[Katana600-4me]

Okay new symptom, a buddy told me to do some work with the a/f screw, I put it down to one turn from bottom....rpms screamed to 10g on start up, then went to 1.75, still at 10g rpms, the went to back to 2 turns.....still at 10g! What the hell did i do!? Now having trouble getting it back to 6g let alone normal idle

[Katana600-4me]

Ok I went through carb 101 again, rechecked float height, turned it to 2 turns on the a/f screw, needles aren't bent, and diaphragms are in good shape, but it still starts at 10g rpms, and I can't check for vacuum leaks cause the rpms are too high....this sucks ass

Ok fiddled with it a bit more, now the idle is at 3G on start up....a step in the right direction but still too high....but it seems funny. I put a new accel cable on it, but when I give it gas and let go it hangs and slowly goes down....then give it a quick flick and it goes back to normal....u guys have been a great help and I'm rounding third now....so almost there lol

[skjeflo]

Ok fiddled with it a bit more, now the idle is at 3G on start up....a step in the right direction but still too high....but it seems funny. I put a new accel cable on it, but when I give it gas and let go it hangs and slowly goes down....then give it a quick flick and it goes back to normal....u guys have been a great help and I'm rounding third now....so almost there lol

What exactly did you "fiddle" with to get it down to a 3K idle? Is that 3K with the choke (enrichment valves) open, closed, part way?

The bit in red above shows some kind of vacuum problem. Could be from the throttle plates being set wrong initially like 92xjunker mentioned. Could also need a sync. Could also be an actual vacuum leak...

[Purplehaze]

Ok I went through carb 101 again, rechecked float height, turned it to 2 turns on the a/f screw, needles aren't bent, and diaphragms are in good shape, but it still starts at 10g rpms, and I can't check for vacuum leaks cause the rpms are too high....this sucks ass

Ok fiddled with it a bit more, now the idle is at 3G on start up....a step in the right direction but still too high....but it seems funny. I put a new accel cable on it, but when I give it gas and let go it hangs and slowly goes down....then give it a quick flick and it goes back to normal....u guys have been a great help and I'm rounding third now....so almost there lol

You *NEED* an Idle adjuster. Your issue may be entirely there now. (Other than a sync)

I'm assuming you went through the carbs and checked the jetting setup?
Do your pilot jets have the little black plugs over them?

Also, it's simply not possible you've followed carbs 101 because it hasn't been the 48 hours required for cleaning. If you did so before the OP then you'll be forgiven. Otherwise you'll have done nothing to properly clean the carbs.

[Katana600-4me]

When I went through it the first time I cleaned the ---- out of the, the second time was just the bottom end and adjustment check, third time was just an measurement and visual chech......the black plugs are in there I saw that in another post and had to buy new ones (not easy to find in Phoenix btw lol)

And I should have specified....I fiddled with the throttle cable by routing it another way....I did it the way it originally came but since I put different headlights on it it seemed i stretched it some.

I looked at it today and it seems to hang because when I let go the butterflies don't set all the way down, then when I flick it they seat all the way down. I checked for vacuum leaks at the boots that connect the carb to the motor and I don't see anything, airbox isn't currently on until I get this idle problem sorted cause its a pain in the --- to take the carbs on and off with it on.

And everybody is saying sync....wat do you mean? Syn the throttle valves on sync the amount of fuel going in....I don't own a monometer so I've been bench synching them.

That's where I'm at and answering your questions....you all are a great help, and we be almost done lol. This is what happens when a guy who can work on efi tries to work on toilets (carbs)! Lol

[arsenic]

So you don't know what a sync is, but I'm supposed to believe you know how to work on EFI? Cause EFI throttle bodies need to be synced too. For the record, yes they mean "sync the throttle valves". The thing you need a manometer for.

[shpielers]

And you'll want the airbox mounted up for that. Leaving it off makes everything run super lean. And idle high.

[skjeflo]

A couple thoughts and some info.

Have the valves been checked? Could be the cause of vacuum leak symptoms if out of spec.

You can't have done Carbs 101 because you are missing the idle adjuster. Without that you can't properly bench sync.

For a full final sync, well, the search tab up top works wonders.

http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=128934

Sync tools:
http://www.carbtune.com/
http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/partno/08-0411/
http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=74642

Airbox being off makes a HUGE difference in how the carbs operate. Have you read that K&N filters aren't recommended for the Kat due to them letting too much air flow? I can only imagine that with zero restriction the problem only gets worse.

[Purplehaze]

When I went through it the first time I cleaned the ---- out of the, the second time was just the bottom end and adjustment check, third time was just an measurement and visual chech......the black plugs are in there I saw that in another post and had to buy new ones (not easy to find in Phoenix btw lol)

And I should have specified....I fiddled with the throttle cable by routing it another way....I did it the way it originally came but since I put different headlights on it it seemed i stretched it some.

I looked at it today and it seems to hang because when I let go the butterflies don't set all the way down, then when I flick it they seat all the way down. I checked for vacuum leaks at the boots that connect the carb to the motor and I don't see anything, airbox isn't currently on until I get this idle problem sorted cause its a pain in the --- to take the carbs on and off with it on.

And everybody is saying sync....wat do you mean? Syn the throttle valves on sync the amount of fuel going in....I don't own a monometer so I've been bench synching them.

That's where I'm at and answering your questions....you all are a great help, and we be almost done lol. This is what happens when a guy who can work on efi tries to work on toilets (carbs)! Lol

It's simple: You simply have to sync your carbs. Once you do you'll never enjoy your carbs more, and without it you'll never get it right. Look into a cheaper homemade solution if you're going to try to cheap out -- Results will vary, though.

At this point I doubt you really have a vacuum leak or even if you do it's null because of your improper throttle operation, that has to come first:

Assuming your carbs have actually been properly cleaned, take a look at your throttle cable or look for something rubber or otherwise flexible in the way of your external throttle operation or your throttle as a whole, might have some weak springs?

[elsueco]

It's too early for a sync. Syncing the carbs is a fine adjustment and will not take care of a 10k idle. Besides, like skjeflo said, you can't do it until you get an idle adjuster.

You said the butterflies don't always close completely; I suspect that's where your problem lies. Assuming the throttle cable and choke cable are correct, how are the spring linkages?

Did you have the individual carbs off the rails when you did your clean? If so, are you sure they were correctly reassembled? I wonder if you have one of the adjusters on the wrong side of the spring, or are missing a spring under the adjustment screw entirely.

When it comes time to sync the bottle method is cheap and works well, but a sync is not going to tame your 10k idle.
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/How_do_...carburetors%3F

[Cheriff]

Air box really should be on for troubleshooting.. And taking the carbs off with the air box attached really isn't any harder, maybe easier. I suspect your idle adjust screw needs backed off (the one with the dial going to carb body #1). Synching is not responsible for a 10k idle. I'm not exactly sure you could get it to rev that high simply from a synch if you tried... Or if it did, it would sound like a 10k lawn mower..

I didn't carefully read all posts, but:
1: back off idle screw completely
2: bench synch carbs so that you see the same amount of each pilot jet hole (however much that may be)
3: put the carbs back on without the tank in place
4: attach the air box
5: run an aux fuel line (either from your carefully placed tank with longer hose or something creative like a rigged upside down gear oil bottle)
6: start tuning from here

You should see a vast improvement and then just need tweaks. This assumes the carbs are actually clean..

[Katana600-4me]

The idle is not at 10k....it's at 3k now that I rerouted the throttle cable, and when I said idle adjuster, I ment that retractable bolt with the knob that moves all the butterfly's to a more open position....is that what you guys mean? Cause I put that back on but not touching the linkage where the throttle cable attaches.

When I took the carbs apart to clean, I did not take them off the rail because I did not want to mess that up.

I got the bike at 3k idle no matter how I touch the throttle now, the butterflies fully close now. I put the airbox on with a new filter and its still at 3k as of today. I no there is now leak from the bottom, are there any common leaks that can happen from the top? Since its at 3k I have to imagine its some sort of vacuum leak.....but I could be mistaken.

I'll be spending all day on it tomorrow so anything a should look at please let me know.....and if you can be specific......like I said I'm primarily a fuel injected car guy lol, kinda in a trial and error with carbs lol

[skjeflo]

I'll be the first to say it, if you didn't crack the carb rack apart then you didn't do Carbs 101 correctly. There are so many places for crap to hide and old rubber to check for cracks and fit that if you don't to the tear down you can't be sure you got it all clean. Shortcuts rarely work when cleaning.

Do you have the small o-rings under the top caps? Seals the vacuum port to the carb body.

All the rubber caps on those same vacuum ports?

Vacuum line to petcock in good shape?

Good soft o-rings between engine and rubber boots?

[Purplehaze]

The idle is not at 10k....it's at 3k now that I rerouted the throttle cable, and when I said idle adjuster, I ment that retractable bolt with the knob that moves all the butterfly's to a more open position....is that what you guys mean? Cause I put that back on but not touching the linkage where the throttle cable attaches.

I got the bike at 3k idle no matter how I touch the throttle now, the butterflies fully close now. I put the airbox on with a new filter and its still at 3k as of today. I no there is now leak from the bottom, are there any common leaks that can happen from the top? Since its at 3k I have to imagine its some sort of vacuum leak.....but I could be mistaken.

Yes, that is what we mean. You *need* to properly bench sync (for the final goddamn time):

Back off the idle adjuster
Adjust all throttle plates FULLY CLOSED (this can be a bit tricky to get them all right) using the sync screws
open the idle adjuster enough to get a perceptible crack in all the throttle plates.

The Idle adjuster should account for the spacing, and in theory you should be able to fully close the throttle plates using the idle adjuster. This is a nearly foolproof way to get a bench sync, and the only way to get the finer, lower-idle range correct.

Start the bike (might have to play with that idle adjuster a bit, and test for vacuum leaks using methods described all throughout this thread and forum. Use fans while doing this -- You're running an Air-Cooled bike in stand-still.

Once you have verified and fixed all vacuum leaks, sync the carbs. Your issue currently stands from incorrect air-flow (vacuum leak), or a less-fine throttle plate operation than you believe. If you problems persist beyond this point it simply has to be a jetting problem, but of-course you already looked that over.

[Katana600-4me]

I waz browsing around da site last night when I came across something.....my bike has a Vance and Hines exhaust and it came with no airbox, I had to purchase that. This got me thinking.....could this be caused from the precious owner putting in a jet kit? He didn't say anything about it and the no airbox made me think did he possible take an aftermarket filter off to keep it.

How do I know if he did....his cell is turned off.

And also I ordered a set of pilot jets off bike bandit and they seem different. The holes on the side of the new ones are bigger....will they work or did I order the wrong ones?