Katana Oil: Let the Arguments Begin...again.

[tnvatdreamland]

Well, It was time to change my oil again in my Kat. I wanted to run a better grade motor oil in my Kat, other than the Suzuki motor oil. Digging deep in my area of the D/FW metroplex finding another senthetic or semi synthetic oil by Castrol or others, that is reasonable and affordable is next to impossible. Found a "hole in the wall" cycle sales and service that carried Castrol Activa, but next to never have it in stock.
So, all flustered, I returned to my Suzuki dealer. We had the "oil" Q&A and the just of their reccomendation was......"Do not run synthetic oil in your Kat. We see too many sport bikes come in here with screwed up clutches that are running syenthetic oil. Please stick to the recommended Suzuki oil. It will not break down, and will not ever void your warranty. Don't have any worries about running this Suzuki oil. The oil debate is way over hyped! If your raceing, that's different, but for street use, stay with this."
So feeling better about it, I bought the $14 a gal Suzuki oil and went on my way, and paid more than half the price I would of paid for semi, or full synthetic. There it is, your comments are welcome.

[The CyberPoet]

People who have clutch slippage issues get them because they are using oils with friction modifiers, such as those formulated into API SJ/SL/SM oils (modern car oils -- which your bike shouldn't be using: see the owner's manual). This isn't the same as a simple synthetic vs. non-synthetic issue -- the slippage issues are unrelated to whether the oil blend is dino-oil, synthetic-basis or full synthetic.

As for finding "reasonably" priced motorcycle-compatible synthetics for your Kat/Bandit/other air-oil cooled Suzuki, the term "reasonable" is debatable in this context (is $3/liter reasonable? $5? $7?). Motorcycle-specific oils are built in far smaller batches and distributed in smaller batches, both of which drive the price up significantly by the time it reaches you at the retail level (more so than any specific technology built into API SF/SG rated oils).



Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[Rody]

I'm looking into the same thing. Funny thing is, the bikeshop around the corner sells their own brand of motoroil, which comes with all the jasoblabla markings. It's really affordably priced. But they only have 10W40 half-synthetic and 10W50 full-synthetic. The best choice would be the half-synthetic 10W40?

Cheers rOdy

[The CyberPoet]

...the bikeshop around the corner sells their own brand of motoroil, which comes with all the jasoblabla markings. It's really affordably priced. But they only have 10W40 half-synthetic and 10W50 full-synthetic. The best choice would be the half-synthetic 10W40?

Depends on your weather... 10w50 protects better and thins less in hot weather, but 10w40 should run easier in cool to cold weather. Thus, if you live somewhere that it's still over 85 in the day, I'd say take the 10w50, otherwise take the 10w40.

As for whether their dealer "house" brand is any good :shrug:
If it's HondaLine or one of the other major mnf brands, it's probably fine (and as long as it says JASO-MA on it, you can't go wrong), but if it's the dealer's own in-house brand, then it could be anything -- until you can find out what brand/type is actually in the bottle, it's a total unknown.

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[Rody]

Hi Cyber,

Thanks for the replies.

The oils both have all the appropriate markings. The thing I don't get is why they only supply full-synth oil in 10w50 while 10W40 is the most common oil, at least here in northern Europe (temperatures practically never pass 35C)...

Cheers Rody

ps http://server01.hein-gericke-store.c...st.currblock=1

http://server01.hein-gericke-store.com/openshop?id=000000dd000000f1002d925000000168236469bd&ArtDetailByID.article_id=7686&Article_Array_actual=15&InclArtList.currblock=1

[The CyberPoet]

They probably do it because their base mineral oil is inherently 10w40, depending on the source of the crude they're using.

As for weights, if your daily commute on two wheels was over 100 km, or if you were planning on a road trip with serious distances (say running down to Nice or Iberia or up to Trondheim), I'd say take the thicker oil. The same applies if you get stuck in traffic a lot in 30 - 35 C weather.

KNOW THIS:
Most firm's oil formulations of even the same name brand/type varies heavily between continents, and sometimes even between countries in the same continent. Thus, while Castrol GPS is JASO-MA and 10w40 or 20w50 in the USA, it's a 15w50 that's not JASO-MA in Australia. Thus, it makes sense to carefully examine whatever oil you're going to buy rather than listening to the claims of someone "overseas" about how well it performs there

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[loudnlow7484]

I use Shell Rotella T 15w-40. That's right, diesel truck oil. I can't feel a difference in shifting between it and normal motorcycle oil (though I haven't tried synthetic motorcycle oil). It's cheap, too. I also used (haven't in a while) Lucas oil treatment. My ex-mechanic was a kz1000 racer, and said he highly recommended it. I didn't notice anything good or bad about it.

And now CP will beat me about the head with a Louisville Slugger for using diesel truck oil in my bikes........

[bigbike-r]

this is what i put in my bike and itaint run since dont know if its out to do with oil or something else should i change it???
it says on the bottle:-

semi synthetic
10w-40
motor oil
enhanced protection supreme performance
ACEA A3 B3 API SL CF

[The CyberPoet]

ACEA A3 B3 API SL CF

I know nothing of ACEA, A3, B4... but API SL is not right for any Katana. Shouldn't keep the engine from working, just messes with the clutch.

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[bigbike-r]

yeah my clutch dont work the basket came lose and when i tightened it back up it wouldnt work its like stuck on so theres no grip do i drop the oil and clean the clutch plates??????

[The CyberPoet]

yeah my clutch dont work the basket came lose and when i tightened it back up it wouldnt work its like stuck on so theres no grip do i drop the oil and clean the clutch plates??????

You get rid of all the oil. Not most of the oil, but all the oil. Drain the oil cooler, the drain pan (overnight), yank the oil filter. Pull the clutch pack and clean the parts off individually with brake cleaner and hope you can get the added contaminants off all the surfaces (that they haven't bonded permanently with the clutch friction plates).
Without putting the clutch pack back in (but with recapping the clutch cover), refill the oil with fresh oil and an oil flush product, then run the engine for five minutes (or as specified by the oil flush product), drain everything again. Now reinstall the clutch and refill the engine with fresh oil again and cross your fingers. If you're lucky, you go everything off and enough of it out that your clutch won't act up again... if you're unlucky, you'll need new clutch parts.

Good Luck!
=-= The CyberPoet-

[Rody]

There are special cleaning oils which you put in, let the engine run for x minutes and then drain. Maybe they could help in this case...

Cheers Rody

[gothicswampy]

over here there is god knows how many different grade in full and semi i change my to different grandes ever time i do a oil change and as yet had no problems

[bigbike-r]

i have a new clutch should be on the way as i thought when it wouldnt disengage the bolts on the friction plates were too loose so i over torqued them and snapped the head off one. so if i take the old basket out drop the oil from the sump plug overnight (how do i drain the oil cooler??) and will i need a new oil filter? then i should be good to go?

i wouldnt mind but i was unsure of the oil and i took the haynes manual to the shop with the specified grade and the idiot instore told me that this oil was what i needed i hate people who try selling you something cos it costs more like it is better when really hes f**ked my bike!
im getting close to taking it to a shop to be fixed but i really wanna do all the work myself so i have something to be proud of at the end of it all ( i hate other people touching my bike) i like to know exactly whats been done for next time it breaks.

[The CyberPoet]

i have a new clutch should be on the way as i thought when it wouldnt disengage the bolts on the friction plates were too loose so i over torqued them and snapped the head off one. so if i take the old basket out drop the oil from the sump plug overnight (how do i drain the oil cooler??) and will i need a new oil filter? then i should be good to go?

Yes, you need a new filter.
To drain the oil cooler, you need to unbolt it and manually drain it.

The real problem is that the engine retains oil even when the oil pan is drained. A normal oil change only changes 65 - 75% of the volume of oil in the engine. Draining the cooler increases that to around 85 - 90% or so. Leaving the plug out overnight as well (or dropping the oil pan totally as well) increases it to probably 92 - 95%. That's why the advice of dual oil changes, so the new oil intermingles with the old oil and helps flush a higher percentage out (90% plus 90% means 99% of the old oil will have been gotten out, which ought to be enough).

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet