[Kreylyn]

Ah ok. Now I have to look for that. I know each coil has 2 connections on it. 1 must be a + and the other a - so dies that mean that each + wire from each coil is connected somewhere from a single wire?

Also why run off the starter bolt? Instead why not just go right from the fuse box? My starters connections look wrapped and covered pretty well. Running a relay right of the batt for its 12v source seems easier to me.

Can I ask wat the cool relay mod cures? Obviously it
Must cure some power draw problem but why is the stock setup an issue?

The + and - on the coils isn't what you think. It's designating the primary and secondary circuits, not postive /negative per say.

Both coils have an orange /white stripe wire. These wires are constant hot with the key on. This creates a primary electrical field.

The other connection is specific to the coils. One is white wire, one is black. These wires have power on except when the system want's the coils to cause the plugs to spark. They create a secondary electrical field. When a coils sparks, what happens is one of the wires (black or white) drops power for a very short moment. That causes the electical field to collapse, creating the high voltage that grounds out the spark plug and creates a spark.

The stronger the field (more power to the coil on the orange/white stripe wire), the larger/hotter the spark will be.

The OEM wiring can degrade over time. Connections get dirty. It shares power with other components like the headlight and dash lights. Over time and years, this call can cause a reduction in the amount of voltage that actually makes it to the coils. If that voltage drops below 11v, you have hard starts on a cold engine. If it goes below 10.5v, you won't get the bike to cold start with the starter/battery power.

The alternator will generally compensate for this and push out enough power that you won't notice any differences in running the bike when this is happening. The single largest issue is starting from the battery on a cold engine.

Problems = very hard to start cold or lower temps = no start at all. Having to push/bump start but immediatly after it will start up with the battery power.

If your bike starts right up with the starter button, you generally are not going to need to do a relay mod.

Krey

[91_gsx600F katana]

gotcha Krey, makes much more sense now. On the Highperformance ignition system I run in my race car the coil basically has a pos and neg terminal which goes to the ignition box, essentially doing prob all that your saying inside the box.

So if I were to do the relay mod then which wire do i use as the trigger? Stated was the power wire that triggers the coils, wat color is this and where is it located?

I guess I could test to see what voltage Im getting at the coils to see if I need this mod? which wire am i checking for the voltage to the coils? I did check the coils and they are within the 3-4 ohm resistence. I've also tried to upgrade all my lighting to LED, all my dash lights are high powered SMD LED's and put off great light I can see my dash no problem now. Also my headlight has been converted to bixeon 55w HID with a 5K bulb. Rear tail light has also been treated to a 24 high powered SMD LED bulbs that ****s all over the stock bulb. I would think Im pulling alot less current than the standard incandesent bulbs.

I do get a nice flicker in the dash lights when i crank the motor over.

Krey also I quickly went through your build thread on your bike and I have a question for you. I want to get rid of all the crap on the back of my bike, license plate holder, rear fender eliminator and I want to put much smaller rear blinkers. I like the ones you got. what is the brand or part number and where did you get them from? also do you have a pic of the license plate holder/blinker brackets? i know i can fab something up but wanted to see how you did it.

ALso i love the 180 rear tire mod, but crap thats alot of work!!! Id be happy to put on a 160 tire or something the 140 is soooo tiny

Also do these bikes need to be inspected? I live in NJ so they are pretty strict on inspections, but Im not sure if I would need to have something like a license plate light on the bike or not. I also want to put a switch in to disable the headlight for day driving.

[da91teg]

I have the same problem. I got 4-1 headers with yo****umasomthing exhaust I forget the name but it won't idle at all. So what I did is that I adjust throttle and the idle were it will idle at 1100 or 1200 without dying. Man its sound like one does Vietnam helicopter.

[Wreckie29]

Idle should be 1500+ and the wire is orange with white stripe.

And I used the battery instead of the starter, the pic was a general pic of the idea of it.

[91_gsx600F katana]

agreed, stock idle speed it 1300 +- 100rpms. my bike idles better at 1500ish with the V&H exhaust.

Ok so which wires to I test for voltage when cranking to make sure the coils are getting enough juice?

[Wreckie29]

orange with white stripe

[Kreylyn]

So if I were to do the relay mod then which wire do i use as the trigger? Stated was the power wire that triggers the coils, wat color is this and where is it located?

The relay mod is to "chagne out" the orange/white strip wires on the coils and provide a direct battey source to them giving you a higher power output to the coils. Use the orange /white stripe wire from either one of the coils for the relay mod "power on" trigger. That wire is already set up to only have power when the key is turned on. This means your relay trigger will work exactly the same. The black or white wires are what is used by the timing to trigger the coils to send a spark. Leave them as they are plugged on the coils.

I guess I could test to see what voltage Im getting at the coils to see if I need this mod?

YES! Otherwise, it's a waste of time and pointless if you have full 12v at the cloils.

which wire am i checking for the voltage to the coils? I did check the coils and they are within the 3-4 ohm resistence. I've also tried to upgrade all my lighting to LED, all my dash lights are high powered SMD LED's and put off great light I can see my dash no problem now. Also my headlight has been converted to bixeon 55w HID with a 5K bulb. Rear tail light has also been treated to a 24 high powered SMD LED bulbs that ****s all over the stock bulb. I would think Im pulling alot less current than the standard incandesent bulbs.

Test the following using a volt meter.

Battery power off
Battery power on
orange/white wire on the coils key on.
Orange/white wire with the starter turning the motor over, but engine not running.

A flicker while the starter is turning the motor over is normal.

Krey also I quickly went through your build thread on your bike and I have a question for you. I want to get rid of all the crap on the back of my bike, license plate holder, rear fender eliminator and I want to put much smaller rear blinkers. I like the ones you got. what is the brand or part number and where did you get them from? also do you have a pic of the license plate holder/blinker brackets? i know i can fab something up but wanted to see how you did it.

ALso i love the 180 rear tire mod, but crap thats alot of work!!! Id be happy to put on a 160 tire or something the 140 is soooo tiny

I custom make my tag/turn signal brackets out of a flat piece of aluminum or stainless steel. Sheets can get picked up at lowes fairly cheap and easy. I then cut out and bend a few parts to make a simple braket. It's just a tag and 2 small lights, doesn't hold a lot of weight.

I use LED 4-6" flexible auto strips for the tag light. Something like these...



Waterproof, self adhesive, and really easy to instal. Very bright, works great. Just make sure they are not in direct eye line of anyone behind you, they are pretty bright. I have a small lip bend down as a "deflector" on all my brackets.

I've had a few variations of the brackets...





As for the turn signals, they are just short stalk turn signals from ebay. The cheaper they are, the shorter they last. I've noticed the rubber part wants to break on them (have had a few different versions) so a non rubber stalk version would probably last longer.

Mounting them you can use the same plate. I just cut out a tab in the center between the plate mouting holes, and bend it back, punch/drill a hole, and mount the shorty stalk there either side of the tag. Like this...



That last pic is an older version before I switched over to the LED light. Looks alot better now days.

Also do these bikes need to be inspected? I live in NJ so they are pretty strict on inspections, but Im not sure if I would need to have something like a license plate light on the bike or not. I also want to put a switch in to disable the headlight for day driving.

Inspections are state specific. I strongly suggest you get a full printout of the NJ requirements for the inspection on a motorcycle and look it over carefully.

For example... NC does not require turn signals at all. So I can use em, or not... I can have non dot types, or not. They don't even have to work at all, because they are not required at all.

Other states have specific requirements that IF they used, they are of DOT type, they must work, they are placed with specific requirements apart and distance from the tail lamp, etc...

Check out your .gov website for your state, I'm sure all the info you need is there.

Krey

[91_gsx600F katana]

The relay mod is to "chagne out" the orange/white strip wires on the coils and provide a direct battey source to them giving you a higher power output to the coils. Use the orange /white stripe wire from either one of the coils for the relay mod "power on" trigger. That wire is already set up to only have power when the key is turned on. This means your relay trigger will work exactly the same. The black or white wires are what is used by the timing to trigger the coils to send a spark. Leave them as they are plugged on the coils.



YES! Otherwise, it's a waste of time and pointless if you have full 12v at the cloils.



Test the following using a volt meter.

Battery power off
Battery power on
orange/white wire on the coils key on.
Orange/white wire with the starter turning the motor over, but engine not running.

A flicker while the starter is turning the motor over is normal.




I custom make my tag/turn signal brackets out of a flat piece of aluminum or stainless steel. Sheets can get picked up at lowes fairly cheap and easy. I then cut out and bend a few parts to make a simple braket. It's just a tag and 2 small lights, doesn't hold a lot of weight.

I use LED 4-6" flexible auto strips for the tag light. Something like these...



Waterproof, self adhesive, and really easy to instal. Very bright, works great. Just make sure they are not in direct eye line of anyone behind you, they are pretty bright. I have a small lip bend down as a "deflector" on all my brackets.

I've had a few variations of the brackets...





As for the turn signals, they are just short stalk turn signals from ebay. The cheaper they are, the shorter they last. I've noticed the rubber part wants to break on them (have had a few different versions) so a non rubber stalk version would probably last longer.

Mounting them you can use the same plate. I just cut out a tab in the center between the plate mouting holes, and bend it back, punch/drill a hole, and mount the shorty stalk there either side of the tag. Like this...



That last pic is an older version before I switched over to the LED light. Looks alot better now days.



Inspections are state specific. I strongly suggest you get a full printout of the NJ requirements for the inspection on a motorcycle and look it over carefully.

For example... NC does not require turn signals at all. So I can use em, or not... I can have non dot types, or not. They don't even have to work at all, because they are not required at all.

Other states have specific requirements that IF they used, they are of DOT type, they must work, they are placed with specific requirements apart and distance from the tail lamp, etc...

Check out your .gov website for your state, I'm sure all the info you need is there.

Krey

Ok thanks, I will check all that tmrw. I actually had to go to the DMV today to get a newly acquired car title changed over and inspected yadda yadda, found out they don't even look at motorcycles for inspection woohoooo! Im gone take it all off.

I actually got the same LEDs as you did and put them in hidden parts of the bike as lighting, looks bad *** and they are bright. I was able to cut the strips and solder new wires on so i was able to make six 3 LED strips for more lighting spots on the bike. Eventually Ill snap a few pics once all the panels are back on.

I also picked up some NON DOT approved little LED smoked rear turn signals. Im going to make it all work, they are like yours but a little smaller.Thanks for all the pics, If i could get some good Stainless or good weldable aluminum Id TIG up some nice brackets. Im not stranger to fabrication, I've built headers, full exhausts, roll bars, subframe connectors yadda yadda.

I like the look of the 600 rear tail light more than the 750 but there just wayyy to much plastic back there and a reflector... lol geez. Maybe Ill post some pics of what I come up with. thanks again guys! ill let you know what I find on the coils. I also was able to adjust the A/F screws with the carbs on the bike! Turned them from 2.5 to 3 turns to see if it will help with cold starting and the throttle blip hesitation. I also used a heat gun to mold back the stock air box, I could never get the #2 carb boot to fit oner perfectly without covering some of the vacuum port at the top part of the carb where the boot slips over. Might be disturbing the air entering the top of the carb so well see. Air box fits like a glove now

[91_gsx600F katana]

I ended up doing the relay mod bc I was only
Getting 8v at the coils when cranking when the batt was like 11.7-12v. I need some help tho. I swapped out the rear blinkers for some led units and I put the bike all back together but now the blinkers don't blink. They light up and stay lit but don't blink. I know that the LEDs pull less current and can be a problem but these are universal lights 2w I think. Wat can be the problem? It's gotta be the flasher but I have no idea where that is

[Wreckie29]

Switch the wires on the led lights and see of it flashes...
Should get rapid flash.

[91_gsx600F katana]

Switch the wires on the led lights and see of it flashes...
Should get rapid flash.

Didnt work the LED tail lights are polorized, switching the wires makes them not work at all.

I jumped and put the stock lights back on and the blinkers worked. So the LED tail lights dont pull enough current to make the flasher work. Now how do I figure out how much current I need to use for it to work.

Heres and update on the ignition coils and relay mod.

Battery off: 12.64V
Battery on: 11.97V
Orange/white Key on: 11.3V
Orange/white while cranking: 8.8V

Relay mod
Orange/white while cranking:9.8V
Batt while cranking: 10.3V

Also checked my Battery charging while running which was 13.79V which seems a bit low, Id like to see it above 14V like 14.2-14.5V.

ALso first time i started it up since the change from 2.5 turns on the A/F to 3 and it seems to run alittle better. Didnt get the bike warmed up enough, just to heat it up for an oil/filter change.

[Kreylyn]

Batt while cranking: 10.3V

If it's that low after the relay mod, you have a battery issue. Load should not drop the V that low.

As for the flasher, go to the local auto store and ask them for a 3 prong LED auto flasher.

Runs about $10-13. Has an integrated load. You just add a ground wire to the 3rd ground prong and conntect to the frame, the other 2 you connect the normal flasher wires too. You can use all or any combination of LED flashers setup after that, and will have the correct flash rate.

Krey

[91_gsx600F katana]

Will that work with incandecent bulbs in the front blinkers?

The batt is odd. 12.6v just hangin out and then turn the key on and the headlight 55w HID turns on and gauges and the voltage drops to like 11.9 ish and then drops to 10.3 cranking an 9.8 at the coils!?

Aren't these little batteries like 100$ or something? Part number? Cranking and cold cranking amps? Good place to get them?

[Wreckie29]

It will work with the stock blinkers and leds yes, and you need a battery bad...

[Kreylyn]

Walmart carries an acid battery you can get for around $36. It's short lived and high maintenance.

You can get/order a gel battery for about double that price. Low maintenance, should last a bit longer.

Or you can get some of the newer higher tech batteries. Lithium something or others. GSXFJim sells a type called Shoria. It's about 1/3 the size, 1/10th the weight, lasts 10X longer than conventional batteries, and doesn't disipate it's charge by just sitting like acid or gel batteries do.

I've also seen the ballistic brand. They are a bit larger in size over the shoria but have similiar qualities to the shoria descriptions.

The last two options are online order. Your local dealer probably carries the sealed gel batteries.

Krey