Leaning Left Tire Jump thing

[kat6hundo]

Yeah I don't exactly know how to explain what's going on. I just changed my sprockets and chain, and i'm 95% sure I put everything back together just as my manual says. But, when I lean hard left the rear tire feels like it's jumping or like........warped really bad(but it isn't). It's only happened 2 or 3 times, but it's freaking me out. Help

[Kreylyn]

Could be an alignment issue, or air level issue....

If you can take pics, left side, right side, and from behind showing the sprocket and chain line clearly, that would help alot to help us help you.

Krey

[scottynoface]

I think something isn't lined up right from the reinstall.

[kat6hundo]

I'll get picture as soon as I get home tonight, I appreciate it!

[Trackerrrr]

Did ya tighten up the rear axle to proper torque spec?

[503 Rider]

Sounds like an alignment issue. I would lay odds that you have your rear tire mis-aligned to the front, and POSSIBLY installed the sprocket out of whack. A quick analogy: If you change a tire on a car and bolt the wheel on tightening the lugs in a clockwise or counter clockwise manner, instead of tightening the lugs one across form another. For instance, if you compare it to the face of a clock; you'd start at 12, then go to 6, then to 9, then to 3....etc. If you didnt tighten your sprocket bolts like this then you could have some wobble in the sprocket, that would definitely casue things to feel out of whack.

Here's the trick for aligning the front to rear wheels using a piece of string (longer than your bike), or a PERFECTLY straight piece of wood or metal, and a ruler. A plumb bob or other suitable weight will also be required.

(I will take this body of text and create a new thread for the process outside of this post as well.)

1.) Place the bike on its centerstand on a flat, even surface. Measure the width of both tires at their widest points. Do not just go off the numbers on the tire. Subtract the smaller measurement from the larger, then devide the difference by two. The result is the amount of offset that should exist between the front and rear tires on both sides.
2.) If a string is used, have someone hold one end of it about halfway between the floor and the rear axle, touching the rear sidewall of the rear tire. (at the outer most point.) You could also try taping one end of the string to the rim of the rear tire, run the string across the back of tire to the other side, and pull forward until taught.

3.) Run the other end of the string forward and pull it tight so that it is roughly parallel to the floor. slowly bring the string into contact with the front side wall of the rear tire, then turn the front wheel untill it is paralell to the string. Measure the distance form the front tire sidewall to the string.

4.) Repeat this procedure on the other side of the motorcycle. The distance from the front tire sidewall to the string should be equal on both sides.

5.) As previously mentioned, a perfectly straight length of wood or metal bar may be substituted for the string. Just hold it paralell to the floor roughly halfway between the rear axle and the floor, against the sidewalls of the rear tire. Measure the distance between the bar/wood and the front tire sidewall. The distance should be equal on both sides of the bike.

6.) If the distance between the string/wood/metal and the tire is greater on one side than it is on the other, or if the rear wheel appears to be cocked, double check the chain tensioner markings, they should be in the same position on each side of the swingarm.

7.) If the front-to-back alignment is correct, the wheels may still be out of alignment vertically.

8.) Using a plum bob, (or other suitable weight and length of string) check the rear wheel to make sure it is verticle. To do this, hold the string against the tires upper most part of the side wall (imagine a 12 o'clock position) and allow the weight to settle juuust off the floor. (the closer the better without touching.) When the string touches the both the upper (12 o'clock) and lower (6 o'clock) tire sidewalls, and is perfectly straight, the wheel is verticle. If it is not, then place thin spacers under one leg of the stand until it is.

9.) Once the rear wheel is verticle, check the front wheel in the same manner. If both wheels are not perfectly verticle, the frame and/or major suspension components are bent.

Good luck, hope this helps.

[cameron]

all i do is 1. use the marks on the swing arm. 2. look down the chain make sure its straight and rolls smooth. 3. go for a ride and drop the bars see if it pulls left or right and adjust accordingly. after that ive always been golden. as far as sprockets being out of wack i dont know. like said previously alway tighten across from the last bolt, nut tightened. when i changed my sprockets on my kat everything fit and worked out. so no experiance with problems their.

[DOCTORNITRO]

Didja leave an axle spacer out?

[kat6hundo]

nice cotter pin right ;P I got all the bolts hand tight before i torqued on them a bit, I didn't torque the axle nut either. I just got a torque wrench and I'm gonna check to see how far off the axle torque was. I don't think I left out any spacers or anything, i didn't have any extra parts lol. I noticed the tic's were slightly off just now, and i had them even when I set it up the first time, so I think maybe I'll re-adjust that, and then make sure it's torque'd right. Do you guys think torquing them in the star pattern is super duper important?

Sounds like an alignment issue. I would lay odds that you have your rear tire mis-aligned to the front, and POSSIBLY installed the sprocket out of whack. A quick analogy: If you change a tire on a car and bolt the wheel on tightening the lugs in a clockwise or counter clockwise manner, instead of tightening the lugs one across form another. For instance, if you compare it to the face of a clock; you'd start at 12, then go to 6, then to 9, then to 3....etc. If you didnt tighten your sprocket bolts like this then you could have some wobble in the sprocket, that would definitely casue things to feel out of whack.

Here's the trick for aligning the front to rear wheels using a piece of string (longer than your bike), or a PERFECTLY straight piece of wood or metal, and a ruler. A plumb bob or other suitable weight will also be required.

(I will take this body of text and create a new thread for the process outside of this post as well.)

1.) Place the bike on its centerstand on a flat, even surface. Measure the width of both tires at their widest points. Do not just go off the numbers on the tire. Subtract the smaller measurement from the larger, then devide the difference by two. The result is the amount of offset that should exist between the front and rear tires on both sides.
2.) If a string is used, have someone hold one end of it about halfway between the floor and the rear axle, touching the rear sidewall of the rear tire. (at the outer most point.) You could also try taping one end of the string to the rim of the rear tire, run the string across the back of tire to the other side, and pull forward until taught.

3.) Run the other end of the string forward and pull it tight so that it is roughly parallel to the floor. slowly bring the string into contact with the front side wall of the rear tire, then turn the front wheel untill it is paralell to the string. Measure the distance form the front tire sidewall to the string.

4.) Repeat this procedure on the other side of the motorcycle. The distance from the front tire sidewall to the string should be equal on both sides.

5.) As previously mentioned, a perfectly straight length of wood or metal bar may be substituted for the string. Just hold it paralell to the floor roughly halfway between the rear axle and the floor, against the sidewalls of the rear tire. Measure the distance between the bar/wood and the front tire sidewall. The distance should be equal on both sides of the bike.

6.) If the distance between the string/wood/metal and the tire is greater on one side than it is on the other, or if the rear wheel appears to be cocked, double check the chain tensioner markings, they should be in the same position on each side of the swingarm.

7.) If the front-to-back alignment is correct, the wheels may still be out of alignment vertically.

8.) Using a plum bob, (or other suitable weight and length of string) check the rear wheel to make sure it is verticle. To do this, hold the string against the tires upper most part of the side wall (imagine a 12 o'clock position) and allow the weight to settle juuust off the floor. (the closer the better without touching.) When the string touches the both the upper (12 o'clock) and lower (6 o'clock) tire sidewalls, and is perfectly straight, the wheel is verticle. If it is not, then place thin spacers under one leg of the stand until it is.

9.) Once the rear wheel is verticle, check the front wheel in the same manner. If both wheels are not perfectly verticle, the frame and/or major suspension components are bent.

Good luck, hope this helps.

Thank you very much for the sweet guide for aligning, I'll put it to good use and report back!

[paul.miner]

Didja leave an axle spacer out?

Looking at the first picture where the castle nut is in further than I would think is normal, it seems possible. When I first got my Katana, it was missing a rear axle spacer:

Missing spacer

Swingarm scraped

I later picked up a factory spacer, but for some reason it was too big: the castle nut wouldn't spin on far enough, so I just used two washers of the right inner and outer diameters.

[Kreylyn]

The first picture showes me that there is something wrong. Your castle nut should not be so far down the axle when it's tight, that the carter pin hole is way off from it.

I would suggest doing the following...

Pull the wheel off and lay out all of the parts. The wheel should be reassembled with all of these parts in this order.

http://www.bikebandit.com/showschematic/m6172sch282727

1. Axle
2. Adjuster washer
3. swingarm (with chain adjuster inside)
4. outside sprocket carrier spacer
5. sprocket carrier
6. inside sprocket carrier spacer
7. wheel (wheel should have { bearing - spacer - bearing } inside. Be sure to inspect your bearings for cracks or movement. Replace as nessasary)
8. brake caliper bracket spacer
9. brake caliper bracket
10. swingarm (with chain adjuster inside)
11. adjuster washer
12. washer
13. castle nut
14. carter pin

Note: as mentioned, I think your missing part number 10 possibly.

Lastly, the chain adjuster spacers (the pieces that have the groves you line up with the swingarm groves for adjustment) are upside down currently on your bike. The curved section goes on the bottom normally, but that would have no effect other than visual really.

edit to add: btw, if you think you will ever get an aftermarket exhaust, put the axle in so that the castle nut is on the same side as the chain. Might save you a headache later on with clearances.

Krey

[RossW]

The first picture showes me that there is something wrong. Your castle nut should not be so far down the axle when it's tight, that the carter pin hole is way off from it.

My kat has an extra washer on the castle nut side to fix that exact problem. And no, it's not a case of anything missing (I have every single part shown in the fiche). If 10 was missing I think the wheel would bind against the brake caliper.

[Kreylyn]

My kat has an extra washer on the castle nut side to fix that exact problem. And no, it's not a case of anything missing (I have every single part shown in the fiche). If 10 was missing I think the wheel would bind against the brake caliper.

In general, over torqueing the axle can cause the box shaped swingarm to "bow" in a bit on the sides accounting for some of that. If your using 1 washer to make up the difference, then your still fine (I'm anal about matching, so I use a stainless washer on both sides as well, but I have a custom axle setup... ). If your using more than 1 spacer per side, I would be concerned.

The top of the nail in his picture is barely catching the outside of the castle nut. It would take 3-4 thick washers to make up for that, and puts it right about the distance that spacer (#10) adds to the overall inside distance, spacing the sprocket carrier away from the swingarm, and would not have anything to do with the brake caliper. Thus the reason to look for that and make sure it's installed correctly.



Krey

[RossW]

You're right, I'm thinking of the wrong spacer. My brain is getting all flipped around this morning. Wouldn't the sprocket studs hit the swingarm without #10 though? I seem to remember them being pretty close.

[Kreylyn]

You're right, I'm thinking of the wrong spacer. My brain is getting all flipped around this morning. Wouldn't the sprocket studs hit the swingarm without #10 though? I seem to remember them being pretty close.

Yes, most likely but not enough to lock up the wheel... just enough to scratch the swinger. See the pics Paul posted earlier in this thread about just that happening...

Looking at the first picture where the castle nut is in further than I would think is normal, it seems possible. When I first got my Katana, it was missing a rear axle spacer:

Missing spacer

Swingarm scraped

I later picked up a factory spacer, but for some reason it was too big: the castle nut wouldn't spin on far enough, so I just used two washers of the right inner and outer diameters.

Krey