[fox24086]

i can always repaint it thats no prob and the body work. i have a guy that wanted to charge me 250 bucks to re-kreem the tank so if i can do this for free thats the route i am going to take.

[Kreylyn]

i can always repaint it thats no prob and the body work. i have a guy that wanted to charge me 250 bucks to re-kreem the tank so if i can do this for free thats the route i am going to take.

Very minimal cost.

My local grocery store has a box of the cleaning soda for like $2 with enough in it to treat 500 gallons of water.

Once it is treated, do NOT put kreame back in. Por-15 is the way to go and you will never have to do this again.

Krey

[fox24086]

i was looking at the por-15. the only question have on that is is it a paint or a kit like the kreem kit or am i wrong?

[Kfreak]

I don't want to damage the outside of my tank, therefore I don't want to submerge it in the solution. In your first set of pic's it looks like you did this to the inside of the tank only. No submersion. I have some light surface rust and want to get it out. Is it possible? I was going to use malt vinegar and BB's to clean it. Where are you finding the POR-15?

[Kreylyn]

i was looking at the por-15. the only question have on that is is it a paint or a kit like the kreem kit or am i wrong?

There is a kit you can get for under $100. Process is a cleaning, a rust conversion soak, and finally the application of the Por-15 coating. Full instructions are included. Do a search for Por-15 here and you will see several threads about it. I have never found an issue with using it that was due to product failure...

I don't want to damage the outside of my tank, therefore I don't want to submerge it in the solution. In your first set of pic's it looks like you did this to the inside of the tank only. No submersion. I have some light surface rust and want to get it out. Is it possible? I was going to use malt vinegar and BB's to clean it. Where are you finding the POR-15?

If you only have light surface rust, dont' bother with this process. Just get a Por-15 kit. The process of applying the Por-15 will take care of light surface rust.

The electrolysis process is really for very heavily rusted tanks. If you only have a few spots, there really isn't a need for it.

Krey

[Kfreak]

I was just going to use vinegar but found something called Evaporust from AutoZone. I did figure your process was for heavy rust. I'm just getting the very fine rust that is causing havoc on my pilot jets.

[Kreylyn]

got ya....

Por-15 kits have a solution they call "metal ready" that will convert the light surface rust and make the surface of the tank extra receptive to the Por-15 coating. So, if you plan on doing the coating, you really don't need to do anything else first.

If you do not use the Por-15, and just use something to clean out the rust.. be sure to rinse very well, immediately follow with a water remover (1 cup acetone works great!), and then if your NOT going to coat the tank with a permanent coat, do this...

Mix 1 cup gas, 2 cups motor oil (of any type really) and pour into tank, coat all surfaces well, dump excess, and use. I did that on my last tank cleaning and have not had an issue with any rust coming back in the last year. No, it's not permanent, but it does help for a little while.

Krey

[RossW]

Interesting random fact:
You can make washing soda from baking soda. Just spread out the baking soda on a tray and bake it at 300F for 30 minutes or so. It will decompose to washing soda, CO2, and water vapor.

I had excellent results using electrolysis to take care of the heavy rust and then using the POR15 kit. I even used electrolysis to clean my fuel level sensor and it still works.

[Kreylyn]

Interesting random fact:
You can make washing soda from baking soda. Just spread out the baking soda on a tray and bake it at 300F for 30 minutes or so. It will decompose to washing soda, CO2, and water vapor.

I had excellent results using electrolysis to take care of the heavy rust and then using the POR15 kit. I even used electrolysis to clean my fuel level sensor and it still works.

... I left the old fuel sensor and petcock in the tank when I did mine thinking they were scrap and the easiest way to seal the tank....

The fuel sensor was frozen up and trashed.... it started working after I treated the tank.

Krey

[Sierraromeobravo]

Thanks for hte help on all of this. I definitely have some rust to get rid of. Found a site that was usuing just Arm & Hammer LAUNDRY soda and Rebar for the rods.

They used a 5 gallons of water to 1/3 or 1/2 cup of Laundry soda. they said that the laundry soda was different then regular baking soda or Borax. Here's a good pic of their process. Oh, and thanks for all the formulas Londob5.

[fox24086]

i started mine on sun and so far so good. i'm using a old axel from a yazoo 3 wheel mower from work thats harden steel and about an inch thick. when you said it was a slow process you didnt lie.

[Great ATuin]

Just to share my experience on the subject...

I did this a couple of months ago. Used about 1 pound of sodium bicarbonate in 40 liter tank of water that i submerged my gas tank in. It took just over night to remove all rust. Anode was 1 foot of 1" wide steel strip coiled in a spiral.

For power supply you can use computer PSU, it has over over 15 amp @ 12 Volt, which is more than enough, and if there a short somewhere (anode touches the tank) it automatically shuts off.

After that, you can use marine epoxy based primer. It's resistant to anything you have on the boat (gas, oil, salt, UV...). Not a single problem with it after 2 months.

It took just 3-4 days to finish.

Good luck...

[BV1]

Great read, great pics and info Kreylyn, enjoyed reading through that.

I will definetly be starting this process on my 85 Katana tank, I will post the before and after results.

I am not much a chemist, but I do know my circuit theory. If you want to increase the current that the water is taking, you do a few things. When you increase the current setting on your charger you are only increasing the voltage slightly to say ~15v.

To increase the actual current flow, you could use two AC to DC inverted chargers in series (same brand ideally) or increase the anaode surface area... or... (chemist guys step in here) add some salt to the mix to decrease the effect resistance of the water, but that may increase the chance of rust forming, if it can form underwater in the solution Im not sure. Just spitting out ideas. Long as its DC, I might even try my DC ARC welder on this. Its still 100% duty cycle at 25 AMPs, however its only 24V, so at most I will probably see 10 amps.

Current = Voltage/Resistance. So lower the resistance of the solution with larger anode ideally or increase the voltage. As the rust builds up on the anode, the exposed surface area decreases and the resistance increases, so the current will decrease over time.

I will keep you posted on results. One thing I still need to find is a giant steel down / anode. I will have to make sure its not stainless steel correct? Can it be just plain iron?

Steve

[jd383]

Hmmm bigger anode rod why not take one out of an old hot water tank ?

[Londob5]

Great read, great pics and info Kreylyn, enjoyed reading through that.

I will definetly be starting this process on my 85 Katana tank, I will post the before and after results.

I am not much a chemist, but I do know my circuit theory. If you want to increase the current that the water is taking, you do a few things. When you increase the current setting on your charger you are only increasing the voltage slightly to say ~15v.

To increase the actual current flow, you could use two AC to DC inverted chargers in series (same brand ideally) or increase the anaode surface area... or... (chemist guys step in here) add some salt to the mix to decrease the effect resistance of the water, but that may increase the chance of rust forming, if it can form underwater in the solution Im not sure. Just spitting out ideas. Long as its DC, I might even try my DC ARC welder on this. Its still 100% duty cycle at 25 AMPs, however its only 24V, so at most I will probably see 10 amps.

Current = Voltage/Resistance. So lower the resistance of the solution with larger anode ideally or increase the voltage. As the rust builds up on the anode, the exposed surface area decreases and the resistance increases, so the current will decrease over time.

I will keep you posted on results. One thing I still need to find is a giant steel down / anode. I will have to make sure its not stainless steel correct? Can it be just plain iron?

Steve

No, that's incorrect.
You need to increase ionic concentration of bicarbonate, not add salt. If you add salt, you will turn this from iron / H2 electrolysis to sodium metal / Cl2 electrolysis and it will hurt your results, as well as release chlorine gas, which is poisonous...not good....oh and sodium metal tends to explode really easily.

Surface area of the anode will not have a significant increase to your rate of plating after the initial coating forms. After that initial coating, resistance increases, so your rate of electrolysis decreases. That is why you see a high rate of amps, but this will quickly drop down after the initial plating. Clean both electrodes often, is the best advice I can give...and keep your bicarb concentration stable.