[blkpitbull]

I've been reading through this thread and everyone makes a good point..except sonny...but I'm still laughing about the comment he made...just funny...but seriously...if anything and I think we all agree make sure she buys gear...helmet, gloves,jacket, boots at the minimum...talk to her BF and maybe he can help her out on buying some of the gear...also tell her about the mods for the Busa...especially the frame sliders...maybe a set of training wheels??? but seriously stress gear especially since she is new at it....

Yes training wheels would be great!!!

Right I agree on teaching her technique, safety, gear, etc....all the stuff we know. If she learns this stuff early and the easy way, she should have NO problem with a busa....

[Scrappy]

At least she can tell her boyfriend, "Mine's bigger than yours."

When I went out to buy my bike, I got the exact opposite because I'm a BIG girl. I got the "Why would you want a 600, you'll find that a 1000 moves you around a lot quicker." In my mind, I translated that into, "Listen fatass, you're going to make that little 600 whimper every time you sit on it, so be a kind soul and get a bigger bike."

I stuck to my guns and promised that when I was ready for a bigger bike, I'd go back and buy it.

My "little" 600 seems to do just fine hauling me around. Plus, I've lost weight, so maybe it won't be so hard on the bike. LOL

[zenjim]

One more metaphor

My friend's daughter recently started playing bass guitar. She didn't run out and buy a $3k Warwick 6 string. She got a Fender 4 string starter for about $150. You can learn on the $3k bass, but it's harder and you are not going to be able to get a lot out of it for a while. With a $150 bass, you're not paranoid about dropping it, lending it out, etc. As a beginner you're still learning how to hold it. In my case they asked my opinion because they were new to bass playing and didn't know where to even begin. In the case of WildKat I believe he was just passing along his opinion through genuine concern. If someone says I've never driven a car before and I'm picking up a Porshe this weekend, it's only natural to question their motives. That's a lot of machine for someone who's never popped a clutch. This is America, so there will always be the disclaimer that anyone can buy whatever they want - of coarse. But there will always be products that are appropriate for certain skill levels in the world of common sense. My only other questions would be is there some peer pressure from the nitrous machined BF? But then, you'd think he'd be pushing her to the Ninja 500 - unless there's some life insurance involved ; )

[Black_peter]

Wow..
In late to this topic but I have to agree (at least in part)
with blkpitbull...

I don't really see how a Hyabusa is inherantly
more dangerous than a Ninja 250..
Kind of like a 22 5 shot revolver and a 50 caliber Auto w/ 20 round clip.. You'll put your eye out with both..
Dead is dead.. crashed is crashed..

I will also play the gender card in that I'm betting
fewer women (or girls) crash their new purchases as often as men (or boys)..
Let me ask you this (if it wasn't asked already I read the posts kind of quick)
What if she just got her licesnse and she was going to buy a big block vett? Or a Mustang Cobra?
Two cars it could be argued are "above" the skills of a new driver.. But both a Hyabusa and a 500HP vett
both have something in common.. a thottle..
Once in gear they don't reach 100 mph with out being told to..
They don't corner at too high a speed with out being told to...
You can high side a 125cc bike..
you can sent a little toyota off the road too..

There are really few bikes that will, by their design
be dangerous to a new rider..
I'm thinking something like a GP bike or a chopper..
The GP bike will have a power curve that could
12 o clock you or break the rear free..
A chopper might be so slow to turn you plow into a
parked car.. or it falls on you
I would be shocked that a new rider would buy a
'Busa based on (as Matt mentioned) insurance
and a tip over..
It is likely (IMO) that a new rider would drop the bike in
a parking lot as lay it down in a corner..

Buy be shocked because it is fast/powerfull?
Nope..

I too have thought that a stepped license would make sense..
Here in the US just a few common sense questions seperate a
16 year old and a GSXR1000.. but at the same time in the UK,
born again bikers have to start over.. Hell if Kenny roberts let his
UK license expire for (I think 5 years) after winning the GP
he would have to start over at under 50 HP...
(or something I used to know the ruling)

That's not right either..

[slayergsxf1]

She'll get on it look straight ahead go to let the clutch out 1 stallit or 2 lurch ahead in first no gas for about 10 feet to a stall and lay it over,she won't get hurt only her ego, she'll either sell it or if her boyfriends smart he'll take it.Yep...Thats what she'll do,,,Shame..

[blkpitbull]

Very well said black_peter!

A crash is a crash is a crash period. It all boils down to what she learns from people AFTER the purchase. Let her know that a busa can be a pussy kat, and a untamed lion all in about 2-3 seconds. Her right hand will determine how well she does. I hope like hell she gets it and rides that thing forever without a hitch!!!! We will see!

[blkpitbull]

She'll get on it look straight ahead go to let the clutch out 1 stallit or 2 lurch ahead in first no gas for about 10 feet to a stall and lay it over,she won't get hurt only her ego, she'll either sell it or if her boyfriends smart he'll take it.Yep...Thats what she'll do,,,Shame..

Or she will get on, ease the clutch, and go down the foad no problem. And think to herself, this isnt that bad!!! I have seen new riders wreck a ninja 250 within 50 feet of where they started ( no shit I watched it happen ). And ive seen others ( my brother) with pretty much no saddle time, get on a zx12 and ride it like he has done it for years. You never ever know!!!

[JoeCool]

I'll put money on the unfortunate high percentage that she doesn't even put 500 miles on the bike...



It's just reality...let's not sugar coat it and say "oh maybe she will be a natural and be okay and pick it up right away"...I have better chances of winning the lotto

I just hope she is okay and wearing full leathers, snell certified helmet, great gloves and boots, as she gets on it in the showroom to ride home...

A friend of mine works in a motorcycle dealership as a salesman and says that about once a week a new rider eats it in the parking lot or doesn't even make it home...a tow truck shows up about a hour or so later with the bike, totalled.

Maybe I'm thinking this way because So Calif is such a dangerous environment to learn to ride in...but again I just wish she would of started on a GS500 or similar used good starter bike. She would be getting some good lessons of riding on the street without having to master a very high end motorcycle at the same time.

I think a graduated license would be great, but they will never do it...and the way the government in general gets around, it would take them 10 yrs to implement it even if it got approved today...

Wishing everyone on KR the best, hope to see all of you out on the road for many years to come 8)

[The CyberPoet]

I don't really see how a Hyabusa is inherantly
more dangerous than a Ninja 250..
Kind of like a 22 5 shot revolver and a 50 caliber Auto w/ 20 round clip.. You'll put your eye out with both..

Although I will shake my head in dismay and think her a statistic waiting to happen, it's not my place to say anything since I don't know her (which I intoned in my first remark, even if I didn't outright voice it). If it was someone I was close to, I would go out of my way to try to convince them otherwise -- but that's because I would want to minimize risk in a highly risky undertaking (let's face it, learning to ride and the first year on the road is very risky in general; as others pointed out, the insurance premiums reflect this statisical fact).

As for your analogy, I think it's semi-flawed. I think it would be more appropriate to compare a long-rifle bolt-action 22 to a desert eagle 50 cal modified to full auto with a hair trigger. Yes, you can kill yourself with both. But you are certainly far more likely to do something you didn't intend to with the hair-trigger full-auto, and the consequences of something you didn't intend to happen with the larger caliber is far more likely to be disasterous.

Similarly, you can kill yourself on a Ninja 250 and on a Busa. But the 250 isn't going to have that same hair-trigger when it comes to throttle operation, reducing some of the risk. It's going to be more maneuverable with her body mass, and easier to stop in a shorter distance than the Busa. And it's going to keep her from having a catastrophy at triple-digit speeds.

This is not to say that I suggested a Ninja 250 as her first bike -- just that I would highly support not using a Busa as the first bike, especially a brand-new Busa. In addition to the inherent differences in potential pitfalls and the increase in possible negative outcomes, there are basic learning disadvantages to any "heavy", "torque-rich" bike (ones I always repost when people ask if the Kat is a good first bike -- most of you have seen them). It leads to learning some poor riding habits that can be difficult or impossible to unlearn at a later date, if you want to improve your skillset -- skills which a lighter, lower-powered, more nimble bike forces you to learn by default (this is also the reason that the common path to MotoGP and other world-cup level racing normally starts in 125 and 250 cc classes).

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[cancun black dog]

Atleast you know you tried lol but that is a scary thought geez thats bad.

Jay

Is that D@D loud??

[Black_peter]

I think you're all just jeleous

[WildKat]

I don't know the girl, you do, so you'll know that maybe (or not) if you push it too hard you'll come off as a holier than though jerk and be ignored. You have to walk a very fine line when dealing with first time buyers.


Out of curiosity though that has her BF said about the Busa purchase?

Thats why Im not bringing it up to her again unless she asks firsts..she has a BF who rides so I doubt she'll be asking me for riding advice that much anyways but if she does, I'll offer her what I can and let her do w/ it what she pleases.

I havent seen her BF yet, I 'll probably see him sunday afternoon at the meeting and if I know him, he'll come up to me and talk to me about her riding and probably try and tell me to talk her out of it

[ghelper]

the easyest thing is to let her ride a bike with some power give her a dirt bike or something that does not matter and swee how she does and if she scares the crap out of her self the she might think different and make sure you point out before she ride it the the bike is 1/3 to 1/4 of the power and 1/3 to 1/2 the weight of the busa and see if she think different after a ride

Good luck

[WildKat]

I saw her this afternoon when I stopped into work for minute to pick up something from my desk. We said Hi and shot the bull for a minute, she didnt bring up the bike other than to say she was looking at helmets online today. So atleast she's starting out on the right foot it looks like. I didnt have time to stay and chat for long so I told her, "Good call, lemme know if you need any assistance in picking one out". And off I went to get some pizza..

[Mojoe]

Re: Thought I'd heard it all

First let me say that I know im gonna get hell for this, especially around here. And I am just stating MY view/opinion. And I mean no offense at all!

OK, Why do you feel you must tell her what bike she should or shouldnt get?? Maybe she cant ride a bicycle with training-wheels, maybe she can ride the bike to the limit. But I DO NOT believe you have the right to force your "ultimate" wisdom upon her because shes buying the bike SHE wants. Its her life period. If you see someone lighting a cigarete, do you stop them to tell them it could hurt them one day??? No I bet you dont. Cause it none of your business. SO why is this any different??? I guess im different and I would not say nothing like that to her, cause I wouldnt want you telling me what I should or shouldnt get.

Perfect example: My younger brother, hasnt rode a bike but a total of maybe 20miles, calls me this may and says " hey bro i bought a bike today. Keep in mind hes 23 ( a grown man that can make his own decisions without my help). I said cool what ya get?? Um a 2002 kawi zx12r. My first thoughts were damn thats big. BUT he can choose for himself. And all I said was " please be carefull, and remember that your right hand decides it all."
He has rode all summer on that bike and rides really good now......

All im saying is that people are grown and make there own life changing (good or bad) decisions on ther own. And I personally dont think anyone should tell someone that they made a bad decision, who made you decision god. I do believe in helping the situation thats already there. Give her pointers, tips, from your experiences....

That said, Im sure ill hear it now. But thats just my view and thats exactly why me and Wildkat are two different people.

Todd

well todd....maybe it has to be me that is the one to give you a little hell, but i think he did the right thing.
your cigarette example....well each and every individual has the right to speak up if you see someone light up. why do you think smoking has been banned in so many establishments? it isn't because these establishments are worried the smoker will keel over and die.....it is to protect the non-smokers from breathing in their secondhand smoke...which is just as deadly. so unless this person lights up outside, well away from all non-smokers, then we all have a right to speak up.

it is the same thing with the bike. you have some unexperienced woman ...and i make it a point to mention WOMAN, cuz i have seen enough women react badly in emergency situations. they tend to panic a bit quicker than a male...and i will go to my grave believing that, so say what you will to that comment, but i am sticking to it. it is also my opinion that this person ..male or female, hasn't any business being on a bike like a busa....much for the same reason as the person lighting the cigarette. she will become a danger on the road with no experience....and we all share the roads....so we all have a right to speak up and voice our opinions. sure....i could say let her buy what she wants, but i would add that i would not want her riding the same roads as myself. we are all supposed to be responsible riders here, and as a responsible rider i believe it is our duty to speak up and voice our opinions to those who have no experience. it is these inexperienced riders who are killing themselves and giving the sport a bad rep. as a rider of 20+ years, i believe i have every right in the world to state my opinion to said person when it effects my reputation.

as for your brother....well, that is your right. if it was my brother, who never rode before in his life....i would be fighting him tooth and nail to talk him out of a purchase like that. my experience/knowledge...as well as statistics, confirms the danger involved, and i love my bro too much to just let him buy on a whim like that.

if you want a perfect example, here is one:

you know someone who has a drug problem. it is endangering his life. do you still just let them make his own decision? no...you speak up. it is called INTERVENTION. I think when someone is making a choice as irresponsible and possibly life threatening as she is making....then intervention is acceptable. the results can be much greater by doing so than the negative results can be if you don't....so how can that be a bad thing?

maybe too many people are getting killed on bikes cuz so many people are just not stepping up and saying something. ever think of that?