[Heeltoeclutch]

maybe cover the end of the fuel line so it can't evaporate out? Don't think enough would evaporate to create a vacuum...

Sorry, not sure I understand the vacuum part - I did not cover it because I wanted the full weight/pressure of the fuel in the line pushing on the needles. If i cover it it would be like putting a finger on a straw, preventing a realistic leak test, I think?

[shpielers]

Possibly, that's what meant by vaccum.

[Heeltoeclutch]

Ok, new update - carbs have been in leakdown test for a day now. There are still a few inches of gas in the 3+4 line, nothing left in the 1+2 line. Heres what the tray looks like:



As expected carbs 1 and 2 are leaking a bit at the gaskets as I saw - however turn them around and we have a little bit of gas on the engine-side mouth:

Carb 1:


And an eensy teensy bit on carb 3:


My question is: What Now? Here's my loose plan:

1. Order new bowl gaskets for #1 and #2.

2. Inspect needle valves on #1 and #3....

I find it hard to believe that the needles are damaged or are the problems themselves, as they look very good. Could it be possible that fuel is getting into the mouths some other way, around an O-ring or something?

I know this thread is getting long... thank you guys for your continued help

EDIT: I may have figured out a clever way to test my needles. Took my Gaserade bottle and ran a 1/4" line to the in-side of the carb 1 float rail, and have the carb 1 needle in place. After about 15 minutes, there is the world's tiniest glob of gas sticking on the end where it wouod come out. Hm.

Perhaps this isn't a realistic representation? If it is, maybe I need a new needle or two. Going to leave it like this til I can work on it in the morning.

[Kreylyn]

Ok, new update - carbs have been in leakdown test for a day now. There are still a few inches of gas in the 3+4 line, nothing left in the 1+2 line. Heres what the tray looks like:



As expected carbs 1 and 2 are leaking a bit at the gaskets as I saw - however turn them around and we have a little bit of gas on the engine-side mouth:

Carb 1:


And an eensy teensy bit on carb 3:


My question is: What Now? Here's my loose plan:

1. Order new bowl gaskets for #1 and #2.

2. Inspect needle valves on #1 and #3....

I find it hard to believe that the needles are damaged or are the problems themselves, as they look very good. Could it be possible that fuel is getting into the mouths some other way, around an O-ring or something?

I know this thread is getting long... thank you guys for your continued help

EDIT: I may have figured out a clever way to test my needles. Took my Gaserade bottle and ran a 1/4" line to the in-side of the carb 1 float rail, and have the carb 1 needle in place. After about 15 minutes, there is the world's tiniest glob of gas sticking on the end where it wouod come out. Hm.

Perhaps this isn't a realistic representation? If it is, maybe I need a new needle or two. Going to leave it like this til I can work on it in the morning.

so you posted a pic of the needles close up a while back... that pic showed clear rings visible in the pic on the needles.

Those rings generally suggest the needle is shot.

I'd replace at this point.

Krey

[Heeltoeclutch]

so you posted a pic of the needles close up a while back... that pic showed clear rings visible in the pic on the needles.

Those rings generally suggest the needle is shot.

I'd replace at this point.

Krey

Thanks Krey - I suppose I didn't really know what was go/no-go for visual inspection of needles. I was expecting cracked, dry-looking rubber and so they all looked better than I expected!

From searching and reading, the only good option I know of for needles are ebay kits - I can call my dealer but in the ronayers or BikeBandit fiches I don't believe they even the list the needle as a part - just the whole float assembly, which I'd certainly prefer not to buy

[Kreylyn]

Thanks Krey - I suppose I didn't really know what was go/no-go for visual inspection of needles. I was expecting cracked, dry-looking rubber and so they all looked better than I expected!

From searching and reading, the only good option I know of for needles are ebay kits - I can call my dealer but in the ronayers or BikeBandit fiches I don't believe they even the list the needle as a part - just the whole float assembly, which I'd certainly prefer not to buy

Float Needle

Bowl Gasket


Or a full kit (generally the more economical route to go...)

Krey

[Heeltoeclutch]

Float Needle

Bowl Gasket


Or a full kit (generally the more economical route to go...)

Krey

Thanks Krey 2 kits have been ordered - for the two leaking gaskets and two leaking needles. In the meantime, I think I'll get started on the brakes/fork seals, etc.

When the kits arrive - is there any MORE stuff that could likely be wrong with the carbs?? I would expect that the gaskets would solve the bowl leaks, and the needles will solve the leaks into the mouths. I sure hope there's nothing else with these darned things I'm missing.

[Kreylyn]

Thanks Krey 2 kits have been ordered - for the two leaking gaskets and two leaking needles. In the meantime, I think I'll get started on the brakes/fork seals, etc.

When the kits arrive - is there any MORE stuff that could likely be wrong with the carbs?? I would expect that the gaskets would solve the bowl leaks, and the needles will solve the leaks into the mouths. I sure hope there's nothing else with these darned things I'm missing.

Pilot jet rubber plugs regularly need to be replaced. Fuel Ts also. Those parts do not come in a rebuild kit. Other than that, I can't think of anything off hand internally.

Krey

[Heeltoeclutch]

Pilot jet rubber plugs regularly need to be replaced. Fuel Ts also. Those parts do not come in a rebuild kit. Other than that, I can't think of anything off hand internally.

Krey

Already replaced all of those - so here's hoping they are good-to-go once the kits arrive.

[Heeltoeclutch]

Mini-update: Carb rebuild kits arrived. I replaced the bowl gaskets in #1 and #2, and the needles in #1 and #3.

Time for Leakdown test #2. After some slight tightening, with the new gaskets there appears to be no leakage from the bowl mating surfaces like there was previously. The big question will be tomorrow - is there any gas coming out of the mouths.



Additionally, I seem to be having the devil's time getting my fuel line to seal against the fuel tees. If the fuel line is sliggghtly not squished all the way against the fuel tee, it leaks (as if the line is too big). I am using clear/blue 5/16" fuel line as I've read recommended in threads here. Is it standard practice to use some sort of clamp? Wondering if I should get some spring clamps for them, or if that wouldn't make much difference - I've tried hose clamping this line onto 1/4" fittings and it still leaked.

[1LE]

Is it standard practice to use some sort of clamp? Wondering if I should get some spring clamps for them, or if that wouldn't make much difference - I've tried hose clamping this line onto 1/4" fittings and it still leaked.

Factory specifies clamps on the fuel tees for my '94. I use the factory clamps plus the factory hoses. No leaks.

[Heeltoeclutch]

Thanks 1LE, yet another thing my bike did not have!

so you posted a pic of the needles close up a while back... that pic showed clear rings visible in the pic on the needles.

Those rings generally suggest the needle is shot.

I'd replace at this point.

Krey

Hokay, so new update. After replacing the float needles in #1 and #3, and setting it up for the Leakdown test again, I now have gas coming out of ALL the carb mouths:



Now as I understand, this could only happen if:

1. Float Needles are worn or damaged
2. Float Heights are set Too High
3. Carb Rail O-Rings are not seated
4. Carbs are tipped over too much

I just replaced two of the needles (and the other two were not leaking prior), so I am pretty confident it is not option 1.

I set the float heights of carbs 1-3 yesterday to the suggested 14.6 mm (as close as I could measure with a high-quality steel slide-rule). But, I have read threads of folks still having trouble with the "suggested" float heights. Wondering if this is my problem...?

Pretty sure my O-rings are seated and intact - I have inspected them every time they are out and ensure they are in there nicely, and replaced one yesterday that was looking wonky.

Mayyybe I tipped them over too much - but I don't really think so? Here is the angle they were at last night. It seems pretty similar to the bike position?



I suppose the easiest thing to try is not leaning them over so much. I am going to compare to the on-bike position and try to replicate it tonight.

[92xjunker]

I would check the emulsion tubes also. Worn needles had to wear on something, usually the emulsion tubes.

[Heeltoeclutch]

I would check the emulsion tubes also. Worn needles had to wear on something, usually the emulsion tubes.

Thanks Junker - my goodness I realize I should have said needle valves, not needles. I replaced the float needles. Darn, still getting the hang of this - my needle jets (?) and emulsion tubes were in great shape, no signs of oblong wear.

[92xjunker]

Oooh my bad, float needles.