[92xjunker]

You could call a throttle body a carb with a big jet pushed by a pump

OK..I see . It's actually the physical air flowing through the carb that initiates fuel flow and slide function.. sorry knee dragger, wont happen again... have a beer on me...

[rubbermounted]

First off (no sarcasm intended), I applaud all of you….
You guys are the best bunch of dudes on the net I have ever had the gracious fortune of communicating with…..getting the info out of you people has been like, trying to extract an infectious tooth from a lions mouth with no anaesthetics…

like I said, very rarely do I ask questions nor give my opinion….
to the “dude” that assumes more often than not, you need to chill and stop over reacting, I NEVER gave my opinion have a close read again of my first post wont take long its only 2 short lines…… see, “NOT my opinion”, only that I used it…..
Purely something to start the ball rolling…. thank you though for directing your uninformative response my direction…(I don’t have nor watch tv so no bonus points for me hey and therefore…a rhetorical, “are you retarded” becomes somewhat insulting doesn’t it, hmmm yep those chill pills are kicking in nicely now)

A special mention to Kreylyn, you are the bees knees of members if I may say, my hat is off to you and I bow in humbleness….people, this person knows how to answer a question informatively, diplomatically and straight to the point without any derogatory nor inflammatory padding, even when I was sarcastic the information was delivered…..this is how YOU as a member will earn respect…as I have now for Kreylyn.

Now with the formalities out of the way…let it begin!
From the start to page 2 this thread has been utterly fricken useless and full of padding in the form of ego’s…then it came on page 3 like a bright light in the distance (oh it was beautiful)….
hmmmm this is when you people became interesting and somewhat informative…..this is quotes lifted from every one who commented (with the crap filtered of course)….and noobies take note….this is what you want to read, the story goes something like this:


Your kat is detuned….Just changing the Kat cams with GSXR cams makes a significant difference in how easy the engine is to tune with the Pods. Swapped the cams, or ... use a completely different engine than the Kat. Like a bandit 12, or GSXR 1127 motor.


The change that made the greatest difference was bumping up the pilot jet.
Most of the world gets bigger pilots than the US, and jumping up to the "world spec" size made an instant and noticeable difference
It's not hard to tune for WOT only, regardless of what kind of carbs/filters you run and on what engine.
I do know that when the old CV-carbed GSXR's were running road course, Yoshimura made an aftermarket airbox for them.
Making the slide holes smaller will start the slides rising faster. Bigger starts them rising later.
Shortening the springs will make the slides rise quicker.
These carbs are very sensitive to float height. Make sure you set them precisely, and if you want to change them while tuning, do it in small increments.
If you are setting up US carbs, you should probably bump up the pilot jet right away. As far as I know, no jet kits include it, but it's too small (smaller than what the rest of the world gets.... emissions, you know)

most, if not all, carburetors operate by way of the Venturi effect, not air pressure for the main circuit, and on engine vacuum for the pilot circuit. The transition between the two is where it gets a little gray and funky. The only difference with CV's is that the slide operates on the Venturi effect as well, opening further as the air speed increases through the carburetor.

From my understanding, the pressure difference between the atmosphere and the amount the butterflies are open moves the slides. Essentially, the vacuum is ported to the top of the diaphragm from the butterfly, and the atmosphere actually pushes the slide up due to the vacuum at the top of the diaphragm from the butterfly's opening.

The shape of the carburetor creates vacuum inside of it when air starts to move through it at speed (with the butterflies open). With the butterflies closed, the engine creates MASSIVE vacuum behind the butterflies.
Like I said, it's the in-between area where things get fuzzy, and also where the tuning problems come in. With the throttle closed, you've got tons of engine vacuum, all you need to do is adjust the a/f screw correctly. With the throttle wide open, you've got venturi-induced vacuum, all you need to do is select the right main jet. Everywhere in between, you are juggling pilot jets (for what's left of the engine vacuum), needle position (for what has begun of the venturi vacuum), slide movement, air jets, etc etc. That's why it can be so difficult. On a mechanical slide carb, there are much fewer variables.

(this has nothing to do with info, I got a warm fuzzy feeling in my groin when I read this….”grass hopper is learning”)
OK..I see . It's actually the physical air flowing through the carb that initiates fuel flow and slide function..

Noobies…. that is some serious shyte!


Now this is “MY” opinion of this whole situation, hell this whole forum….

You guys need to be a bit more realistic and settle the fook down, I maybe a 10 post or so noobie but shyte I am sick to death of jumping from forum to forum because of the inflated crap that answers a genuine question….eventually you guys gave some serious info, to be honest that extracted info has now confirmed my thoughts, that my pods will be purely for aesthetic purposes and my motor will suffer from the mod how bad is up to my ability (they were for looks in the first place, anyway)….cool, will have a look at efi later.

The rest of the crap though seriously…it’s embarrassing, I had to ask stupid and dumb arss questions to get any substantial info….like, why isn’t it on a race bike…oh my god… please people don’t give your ego opinions, save that for your mates here people like me want knowledgeable opinions positive or negative regardless and delivered with empathy not delivered with useless uninformative and egotistical attitude…(this is why I don’t ask questions)

(taking a breath) Finishing off now,

I am so fookin impressed with the level of knowledge that some of the members have here…..its just a little disappointing though that easy answer crap is given….

Nuff said!

[scottynoface]

Next time try using the search function then, because this question has been answered ad nauseam at least three times a week for the last five years.

[hinow41]

I disagree

[Badfaerie]

Rubbermouth, darling...

You call us ego driven jerks, and claim to be an innocent victim, but your own egotistic behavior has contributed to the conversation.

First - There are currently 3 other active threads on this subject. Instead of reading those, checking the Wiki, or doing some independent research you started a new thread of you own. Is it because you feel the information will be different for you than it is for someone else? Or do you feel that you deserve to have it given to you and not have to take a few minutes to work for it?

Second- The answers you were given all boil down to the same thing; for these bikes, POD filters are a bad idea because the way the bikes are set up is it close to impossible to get them to run correctly. The answers you like are just more technically detailed versions of that statement. If you wanted more detail as to why, could could have asked for more specifics. I know Kreylyn for one gets really involved with researching technical details for folks here. He gets into it enough that he's stayed up all night researching and preparing posts. But that is not what you did. You said "I'm doing it anyway, tell me how to make it work". Your own confrontational manner draws the same.

Third- 99% of people that ask these kinds of questions don't have enough knowledge to understand the details. This forum is a lot like computer tech support, a good tech support person will tune their instructions to the knowledge and understanding level of the person on the other end. Not knowing that, you start out giving instructions in the most basic way and working up from there depending on the responses you get back. You gave very little indication of you knowledge level in you first post. In follow up posts, your own claims of experience were counter to some things you had said. Specifically, if you have a lot of experience with these carbs, you would understand many of the reasons why pods are a bad idea, and not had to ask here. These kinds of inconsistencies set off the "Troll Flag" in people's head. Then there's always the question of why you ask "us" if you already know the answer.

Finally, I'd like to beg you to do some more research before you go with pods. There are a few other "gotchya"s with getting them to work properly. One being keeping airflow even between the carbs. As you go faster more air reaches the outer carbs than the inner ones. This will cause carbs 1-4 to run leaner and 2-3 to run richer. The air box makes sure that all 4 carbs have equal air flow no matter the speed or how the air is moving around the bike, pods have no way to regulate that. This is where you get into velocity stacks and custom made solutions. If you are just going for the more open visuals, this can really mess up your aesthetic.

So, before you get all butthurt because people were being mean to you, understand that you came across with attitude as well. Step up and take at least partial responsibility. I do have to agree with you though, Kreylyn's pretty awesome. And cute too. He does tend to get lost in the details though.

[steves]

I'm not really sure where this thread is going any more.

From all the evidence I've seen you CAN run pods HOWEVER (that's a big however) it's going to take some time, effort, and a dyno run or two in order to get it sorted out.

You can't just throw on a set of pods and a jet kit and have it run well.

So the "general" advice is "don't run pods" and "don't run K&N filters" since for 99% of the audience that's the answer they need.

[05RedKat600]

First off (no sarcasm intended), I applaud all of you….
You guys are the best bunch of dudes on the net I have ever had the gracious fortune of communicating with…..getting the info out of you people has been like, trying to extract an infectious tooth from a lions mouth with no anaesthetics…

like I said, very rarely do I ask questions nor give my opinion….
to the “dude” that assumes more often than not, you need to chill and stop over reacting, I NEVER gave my opinion have a close read again of my first post wont take long its only 2 short lines…… see, “NOT my opinion”, only that I used it…..
Purely something to start the ball rolling…. thank you though for directing your uninformative response my direction…(I don’t have nor watch tv so no bonus points for me hey and therefore…a rhetorical, “are you retarded” becomes somewhat insulting doesn’t it, hmmm yep those chill pills are kicking in nicely now)

A special mention to Kreylyn, you are the bees knees of members if I may say, my hat is off to you and I bow in humbleness….people, this person knows how to answer a question informatively, diplomatically and straight to the point without any derogatory nor inflammatory padding, even when I was sarcastic the information was delivered…..this is how YOU as a member will earn respect…as I have now for Kreylyn.

Now with the formalities out of the way…let it begin!
From the start to page 2 this thread has been utterly fricken useless and full of padding in the form of ego’s…then it came on page 3 like a bright light in the distance (oh it was beautiful)….
hmmmm this is when you people became interesting and somewhat informative…..this is quotes lifted from every one who commented (with the crap filtered of course)….and noobies take note….this is what you want to read, the story goes something like this:


Your kat is detuned….Just changing the Kat cams with GSXR cams makes a significant difference in how easy the engine is to tune with the Pods. Swapped the cams, or ... use a completely different engine than the Kat. Like a bandit 12, or GSXR 1127 motor.


The change that made the greatest difference was bumping up the pilot jet.
Most of the world gets bigger pilots than the US, and jumping up to the "world spec" size made an instant and noticeable difference
It's not hard to tune for WOT only, regardless of what kind of carbs/filters you run and on what engine.
I do know that when the old CV-carbed GSXR's were running road course, Yoshimura made an aftermarket airbox for them.
Making the slide holes smaller will start the slides rising faster. Bigger starts them rising later.
Shortening the springs will make the slides rise quicker.
These carbs are very sensitive to float height. Make sure you set them precisely, and if you want to change them while tuning, do it in small increments.
If you are setting up US carbs, you should probably bump up the pilot jet right away. As far as I know, no jet kits include it, but it's too small (smaller than what the rest of the world gets.... emissions, you know)

most, if not all, carburetors operate by way of the Venturi effect, not air pressure for the main circuit, and on engine vacuum for the pilot circuit. The transition between the two is where it gets a little gray and funky. The only difference with CV's is that the slide operates on the Venturi effect as well, opening further as the air speed increases through the carburetor.

From my understanding, the pressure difference between the atmosphere and the amount the butterflies are open moves the slides. Essentially, the vacuum is ported to the top of the diaphragm from the butterfly, and the atmosphere actually pushes the slide up due to the vacuum at the top of the diaphragm from the butterfly's opening.

The shape of the carburetor creates vacuum inside of it when air starts to move through it at speed (with the butterflies open). With the butterflies closed, the engine creates MASSIVE vacuum behind the butterflies.
Like I said, it's the in-between area where things get fuzzy, and also where the tuning problems come in. With the throttle closed, you've got tons of engine vacuum, all you need to do is adjust the a/f screw correctly. With the throttle wide open, you've got venturi-induced vacuum, all you need to do is select the right main jet. Everywhere in between, you are juggling pilot jets (for what's left of the engine vacuum), needle position (for what has begun of the venturi vacuum), slide movement, air jets, etc etc. That's why it can be so difficult. On a mechanical slide carb, there are much fewer variables.

(this has nothing to do with info, I got a warm fuzzy feeling in my groin when I read this….”grass hopper is learning”)
OK..I see . It's actually the physical air flowing through the carb that initiates fuel flow and slide function..

Noobies…. that is some serious shyte!


Now this is “MY” opinion of this whole situation, hell this whole forum….

You guys need to be a bit more realistic and settle the fook down, I maybe a 10 post or so noobie but shyte I am sick to death of jumping from forum to forum because of the inflated crap that answers a genuine question….eventually you guys gave some serious info, to be honest that extracted info has now confirmed my thoughts, that my pods will be purely for aesthetic purposes and my motor will suffer from the mod how bad is up to my ability (they were for looks in the first place, anyway)….cool, will have a look at efi later.

The rest of the crap though seriously…it’s embarrassing, I had to ask stupid and dumb arss questions to get any substantial info….like, why isn’t it on a race bike…oh my god… please people don’t give your ego opinions, save that for your mates here people like me want knowledgeable opinions positive or negative regardless and delivered with empathy not delivered with useless uninformative and egotistical attitude…(this is why I don’t ask questions)

(taking a breath) Finishing off now,

I am so fookin impressed with the level of knowledge that some of the members have here…..its just a little disappointing though that easy answer crap is given….

Nuff said!

Thanks for writing all this just to let me know I won't ever respond to any of your posts.

[Badfaerie]

Do pod filters help with anger management?

[05RedKat600]

do pod filters help with anger management?

+1,00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 000000000000000

[steves]

I have read countless threads about the K&N pod filters and how terrible they are. or i should say how terrible they make the bike run.

I bought my old beat up 88 Kat 600 and it was missing some parts. Specifically one side of the exhaust and the air box was also gone. I have ordered and waiting for the arrival of my new vance and hines 4-1 pipe and header. I thought I could solve the missing air box issue by putting on the pod filters on each carb. I have them ordered aswell.....before i found out how much trouble they are...

I wanted to know why people have such problems. I assume most people that put them on have 1.) stock exhaust, and 2.) also don't realize its changing the amount of air that flows through the filter (400 cfm more) which changes the air/fuel ratio. These bikes being carburated don't self adjust like a fuel injected bike would so they run like bags.

Also what do you do with the one hose that goes into the airbox??? with no air box are you plugging it? putting a breather filter on? I believe its a PCV so should be good with a breather filter on it.

Does anyone run the carb filters and like them? what did you have to do to make it run nice?

Don't run pod filters unless you are going to get dyno tuning done, because otherwise it won't run correctly.