Vinyl what to look for

[zleviticus]

I would like to get some vinyl stickers done for my kat. Maybe somethign with my screen name for my windscreen. To go next to my katriders.com sticker when we get them.

what should i look for in a vinyl? I want something that is going to last not have to be removed and redone every year... especialyl if it is somethign I am going to place on a sportech window (when i get one.)

thanks,
Z

[Froggy]

I have used a lot of 3M vinyl. The 2 mil is said to "B the Best". Have installed it on our ultralight, and on my bike. What would be really nice, is if the shop doing the stickers could make them more of decal (rather then a sticker). It would look much more professional on the bikes. Attached is a pic of the local maritime site I have on my bike.

[fulcrum]

This is something I know about as I'm involved in the sign industry.

3m is one of the good brands, but like all products they can have bad batches. Most vinyls are pretty good these days.

The main concern is to get a true cast vinyl. There are 2 ways of making vinyls, one is cast and one is calendared. Cast is thinner and allows the vinyl to be stretched without losing color (important when going over bumps and curves on a fairing). Calendared is thicker and generally cheaper. Cast may cost up to twice as much for the material, but it is worth it for this purpose.

When applying over a surface with a concave curve in it, apply the vinyl flat over the concave bit. Then heat the vinyl (a hairdrier is best as a heat gun might get it too hot). Once it is warm it will stretch easily and you can press it down into the centre of the curve. Then smooth it out along the rest of the curve.

If unsure, get a pro to install it. They make it look easy

Brands I know that you can get in the US and are good: 3m and Avery.

Feel free to PM me for more info if you have a specific question.

[The CyberPoet]

The only thing I have to add is that if you get print-on-vinyl (in other words, multicolor printed designs rather than single-color cut vinyl or multiple pieces of vinyl cut to fit together), make sure to look for the UV-resistance of the material. My experiences as a consultant to the sign industry match that of Fulcrums; 3M and avery are the brands to prefer, with 3M being the better as far I've been informed.

Cheers
=-= The CyberPoet

[fulcrum]

To add to Cybers post regarding printed stickers, there are two main types of printing at the moment in the industry.

The first is based on resin ribbons where the resin is heated into the surface of the vinyl. For tiny stickers the Roland Colorcamm does a good job, but as it prints in about 8mm (1/3 inch) wide bands you can see them in larger stickers. For a large resin sticker it would most likely be printed using a Gerber Edge machine.

The newer style of machines are inkjets. There are a few types here. Your basic printer at home is a water based dye system. The color is a dye in a water carrier. Useless on vinyl and the dye fades very quickly. The next evolution was water based pigment machines where the color is a pigment carried in water. Doesn't fade as quick, but still won't stick to vinyl - needed special materials. Now we have solvent systems. Basically a pigment in a solvent carrier. The solvent can bite into the vinyl and leave the pigment behind (yay!!!). Some solvent machines print at 1400dpi or higher and are great for 1 off custom designs.

They should be laminated with either a clear film laminate (better in my opinion) or a spray or roll on liquid laminate. That will give added UV protection to the prints, which makes them last longer before fading. They will still fade (laminated you may get up to 5 years outside depending on the laminate used and the levels of UV in your area). The film laminate will stop you being able to get to the print with any chemicals you use to clean the bike.

There are also screenprints which last longer, but the cost of a one-off screenprint is very high. If you want a couple of thousand that is the way to go however.

If anyone wants to do a sticker for you and says "nah, no need to laminate" tell them to print something for you as a sample. Watch them print it, take it home and wait 24 hours. Then rub the dark colours on it. See them smudge? Fun huh?

Now, that is more than most of you want to know, but there you have it.

Use this knowledge wisely

[zleviticus]

thanks guys that helps a lot.. it is nice to get informed answers.

now my question is you menetioned to make sure it is like a decal and not a sticker what is the difference?

[Froggy]

My thoughts on the difference is that a sticker is a solid vinyl with color on it, where as the "decal" would be a solid color with the words/logo cut out, so when applied to the bike, it's only the words/logo (no backround), not a square/round, etc backround with fancy colors. Not sure if I have explained myself right. I just purchased a new windscreen and the windscreen came with a sticker and the company that I purchased it from sent me a sticker. I am happy with both the product and the service I would happily advertise, but I won't put their "sticker" on my bike.