[WildKat]

in group rides, usually the leaders of the ride in front will signal for everyone else about cops,debris on the road etc, then it works its way back to the line.. but yeah.. 50 bikers waving their hands over their helmets wouldnt attract much attention would it

[SoloScott]

(A) Whether you call them community standards or ticket quota's, performance expectations, etc., there are a certain expected level of citations to be written in almost all departments in the USA. An officer in Pinellas county (FL) was fired about 18 months ago because he hadn't written any non-DUI traffic tickets in the past two years; his arguement was that the verbal warning he gave motorists would be as effective and no cause financial distress on anyone. Thus, while it can be said police officers don't personally receive ticket money, their jobs are on the line when it comes to writing tickets (and generating revenue)

(B) Although the money doesn't go to the officer, in most jurisdictions, a large portion of that money goes back into the police coffers in the end. Thus, the organization as a whole benefits from the ticket writing, and such revenue helps offset increases in property taxes (which helps keep politicians re-elected; thus it is supported by the powers that be).

(C) The concept that the combination of absolute compliance with arbitrary speed limits, and traffic tickets save lives is basically flawed. The real problem is a multi-fold one of lack of sufficient training. The German roadway system (I am a German-licensed Driving Instructor) operates without speed limits in many places and with very high speed limits in many places, yet on a per-mile and a per-driver basis, the Germans suffer fewer crashes, fewer injuries and fewer fatalities. Why is that? Because the Americans spend money on generating money (more traffic units, more detection systems) while the Germans require their drivers to go through far better training to learn how to judge safe speeds -- and then leave that decision up to the driver when feasible. The fact of the matter is that there is such a thing as too slow for safety; a look at the traffic fatalities, injuries and crash statistics for Lincolnshire (UK) for the last three years will show that dropping the limits in half for many of the thoroughfares almost doubled the traffic fatalities. Why? Because a bored driver is one who doesn't pay attention, who gets frustrated with the delays, who is more likely to act wrecklessly to pass once out of a limited speed zone. People usually have a fair conception of what safe speed is for their particular circumstance -- and darwinism will gladly take care of the rest.

I find your arguments weak and without much merit... but I understand that some people have inate need to comply with other's imposed rules no matter what the cost, thinking somehow that the lowest common denominator is the best for the masses.

Hmmmm...
=-= The CyberPoet

I ABSOLUTELY COULD NOT AGREE MORE!!! Thank you Cyber for saving me from all the typing. I simply cannot get most of my friends to understand this point. Safety is not letting everybody drive if they go slow; safety is getting the bad drivers off the road, or at least making them better!

On the topic of cops "fat asses at Dunkin Donuts"....
Let me preface that I am not a cop, I don't have cops in my family, nor am I close friends with any cops. However, it's really sad to hear some of the trash talk about crooked cops. Yes, I will admit that they exist, but I have nothing but respect for them and the job they do. We are complaining about them being sneaky when giving out speeding tickets, and these are the first guys to appear when our safety is threatened. The cops who are giving out illegitimate speeding tickets are doing so based on the laws created by other people. They don't make the laws! It sounds like the cops are taking the heat for CROOKED LAWS.

I should add, while we're on the topic, that I got pulled over going to work today. I was driving 43 in a 35. Since I just bought the car and I'm waiting for the insurance company to send me the proof-of-insurance cards, I did not have one to prove insurance on the car. I got a $538 fine!! The cop suggested that I take my insurance card to court when I finally get it and there's a good chance it will be thrown out.

[WildKat]

If you can get proof of insurance, that you were covered when you got pulled over, they may still give you a fine for not having it, but it will be greatly reduced, if not thrown out completely. driving without insurance is a hefty offense to say the least.

Did you keep insurance w/ the same company you previously had? if so, they can see when they call in your plates to verify if u have valid insurance.

[SoloScott]

I hope they don't fine me....

I called my insurance company. It turns out that I have had one of the little insurance cards for a few weeks now. The company now prints them on the back of one of the coverage info sheets, in a booklet they send I wished I could simply show proof of insurance later on in the day, when I found the card at home Nope, I have to send papers in and go to court when they give me a date.

Yes, I've had insurance with the same company all along.

[WildKat]

Damn, thats stupid ! if you get pulled over and cant produce ur license, they'll give you 24 hours or so to produce it. why not the same w/ insurance!!??

[md86]

I've been pulled over before w/ no proof of insurance . Actually , he didn't even ASK me for it . I'm pretty sure they can run your plates to see if you're insured or not anyway . Sounds just like a basic "fix-it" ticket , where you go and show them that the problem was fixed and they throw it out .

[Zuzu_2000]

Ahem... To answer the original question...

In the cage... I usually don't try to warn anyone...
On the bike... I will most often use the tapping of the helmet sign to warn other bikes, regardless of sport, tourer, cruiser... whatever, though it doesn't appear most riders understand. (If someone is screaming though, I usually won't warn them... they deserve what they get if they are being a complete idiot... yeah I said it )

[HexKrak]

Here the majority of the cops on traffic duty for the city of phoenix (city, state, and county all have different policies) are 95% of the time on probation for doing something wrong already. Me wonders why people have such a poor view of the Phoenix PD...

My opinion is that people should only be pulled over for excessive (reckless) speeding that way the po can focus on pulling over the generally reckless drivers. I'm sick and tired of having my lane taken over, or being cut off incredibly close, or seeing some idiot driving while reading the morning news flying by a po, but just because they were going the speed limit they dont do anything about it. Maybe if we got these shmucks off the road we could see a morning without 20 accidents announced during the ride to work. People get pulled over for speeding because it's easy to catch, easy to prove, easy to ticket. Maybe if police didn't have to fund raise because they were being funded correctly in the first place they could focus on keeping the meth off the streets.

Oh, and stop letting idiots set the speed limit to ridiculously low speeds. I can respect school zones, and residential areas, but 45mph on a 6 lane highway with no intersections (only exits and entrances) is f*ing stupid.

[frosti108]

no doubt. i hate the idea of anyone getting over on anyone else. so if i can help out a soon to be victim, i will

btw i always use my high beams in the car. on the bike i havent really done it at all that i can remember. but i would probly hit the high beams as well

[Catcha23]

I warn them in my truck and on my bike by flashing the headlamps a couple of times. If they get it, then good, if not.. oh well, better them than me... I tried!!

[md86]

Wow , so , this thread is back from the dead after 3 years . Is that a record ?

[RH55]

I use the twirl above the head method to warn bikes if I'm out of the officer's line of sight...

[STULER]

i always warn other people because they normally warn me i have found out

[diavolo]

I always give a pat on the helmet passing other riders that are heading into the cops' range. Just a common coutesy to check their speed, and avoid the unpleasantness of a ticket.

[IndyGunner]

I always do even infront of the cop....

one day i was out riding to my bank to get money, on the way there he had someone pulled over... well on my way back i went like 20mph down that road and just stared right at him. I saw him whip out his radar gun and i just laughed kuz i was goin 20 in a 35.

then after i passed i pointed to him and patted my helmet, saved like 3 cars