Hard cornering chalk or butter???

[cobra1379]

I'm pretty new to streetbikes. I've done alot of dirtbike and fourwheeler riding but not much pavement. My question is how much warning do you get before the bike slides out from underneath you when cornering hard?? Will it slide slowly and consistantly like chalk on a board or be all tight then slam like hitting hot butter?? I know it will have alot to do with tires and road conditions but any advice could probably save some rash.

[WildKat]

It really does depend alot on the road conditions and your tires. If you hit some gravel, dust, or other debris on the road, it can slip out from under you in a heartbeat and before you know it you're low siding. Or... you can hit a small slick spot on the road like a patch of oil, water, gas, or whatever and your rear tire can slide or skip for a second and then grab quickly again which could cause a high side if you aren't careful if you panic and grab a handful of brake.

[ZukiFred]

Also some good riding gear will help save you from road rash if you do go down..

[Black_peter]

Like Matt said..
I will add that sometimes you can lose the rear and
not lose the bike, you just side step a bit and go
on your way (with some residual clenching)..

[shefkat2000]

Scary Stuff. Simply scary. I like personally to go straight over the handle bars and roll 10-15 times...Yet another reason to wear protective gear.

[cobra1379]

So chalk unless you hit some butter then??

[iwannadie]

i was taking a turn and got on the gas a little to much dont think i hit any 'butter'. the wheel started to spin loose and the backend slid to the side it did feel like chalk when i think back about it. i felt it going to the side and got off the gas just enough to stop the wheel from spinning and made the turn fine.

[cobra1379]

Ok so if I run the same road slowly getting faster and faster there will be some warning that says enough is enough?

[woobie]

Ok so if I run the same road slowly getting faster and faster there will be some warning that says enough is enough?

Flashing blue and red lights and a siren are normally a dead giveaway .

Seriously though, with good tires you can lean a Katana right over to knee down angles and she'll hold the line. Just remember that leaves you little to no margin of error if you should encoubter debris, car in your lane etc etc.

[iwannadie]

Ok so if I run the same road slowly getting faster and faster there will be some warning that says enough is enough?

Flashing blue and red lights and a siren are normally a dead giveaway .

Seriously though, with good tires you can lean a Katana right over to knee down angles and she'll hold the line. Just remember that leaves you little to no margin of error if you should encoubter debris, car in your lane etc etc.

just remember if your doing this on some road you think is clear its still risky. just cause it was clear the first 5 times doesnt mean some car didnt come along and drip some oil and thats all it will take to mess you up.

[KatanaBadass]

I can't say it feels like butter or chalk, all I feel is a certian orafice slamming shut and my disturbing but always ammusing life flash before my eyes.

[jason05]

i lowsided two times. both times, no warning. bike just slid the rear out and that was that. but, with the correct riding position and skills, i dont have that sort of problem anymore. i have slipped the rear around high speed turns before, and saved it. usually stay in the throttle pretty good and hold the slide... hopefully my lane positioning keeps me on the road. but, the problem with that, is that people over correct and turn a simple slide, possibly a lowside, into a nasty highside. youll get the feel for it.

[Anonymous]

I say more like chocolate then butter...
(dark chocolate....check yer drawers!)

[The CyberPoet]

IMHO:

It depends extremely heavily on the tire type and which tire we're talking about (front or rear):

Fronts:
Macadams, Dunlop 205 & 207's (not 207RR's) all went from being grippy to momentary chatter to being zero grip when they gave because I exceeded the limit of traction (not because of road debris issues). It wasn't even butter -- it was extra virgin olive oil (EVOO). Cheng Shins felt like they were made of solid steel from the get-go, with no real grip to write home about at any lean angle.

Pirelli's Diablo's & Diablo Stradas, Metzeler Z4 & Z6 on the other hand start to slide laterally a wee bit, then start to bunny-hop very minorly before they slide some more and finally let go, and if you're a skilled enough of a rider, you can feel that lateral movement on the front enough to say whoa, ok, I've reached my limit (and hopefully have enough room to back off it without damages).

Rears:
Rears break loose for two different reasons aside from road surface debris -- past the limit of traction (lean angle) and past the limit of traction (accelerating & braking, mostly accelerating under hard throttle out of a corner).

Upright rear braking:
The Macadams, Dunlops tended to skid at the braking limit in the rear. The Pirelli Diablos tended to skid as well, but further into the braking force because of superior ground traction.
The Diablo Stradas and Z4 & Z6 Metzelers tended to bunny hop minorly (3 bounces) before locking into a skid, which was enough to release the brake again before they came down again. May have been influenced by my suspension settings on the OEM suspension, which was set with standard 4 clicks of preload...

I've never lost a rear from lean angle issues on dry/clean pavement on a Kat, although I have run up onto the lip some manufacturers put at the edge between the tread area and the sidewall and felt the tire squirm as a result.
On wet roads, I've had the rear sweep away under acceleration coming through a turn, with only the Dunlop 205's & Macadams actually failing in this sense (the 207 didn't, the Pirelli Diablo communicated early enough to catch it, and the Metzeler's are simply like glue in the rain). In each case on the Kats, I've been fortunate enough to be able to recover.

WORDS OF WARNING:
Unless the places you are testing these limits have huge, flat over-runs made of soft-stuff (like fields of grass), AND unless you are intimately familiar with the road (able to virtually drive it by muscle memory), testing the limits of adhesion for tires is a very, very dangerous undertaking, and should ideally be reserved for a track enviroment with stand-by medical personnel.
certain compounds that can be present on the road surface can totally zero your traction as soon as you hit it. Included in this list is automatic transmission fluid, most brake fluids, most motor oil, diesel fuel/heating oil (the worst of all, esp the colder the weather), fine grain sand, gravel and ice of any form. When it first starts to rain, concrete and most forms of tarmac will lift any oil deposits up out of the pores, making the surface extremely slippery.

KNOW THIS:
The better tires on the market will exceed whatever you are capable of on the Kat, as long as the road surface is good and clean.

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[USCGC_Katana]

Speed limits are there for a reason, just for me. I get scared just reading this stuff. But I learn something every time. I will be the slow one out there, I'll pull over and let you by. Still saving for my Z6's.
Be safe.