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two line brake conversion? want less effort/more power

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  • two line brake conversion? want less effort/more power

    I was looking around at stainless braided brake lines and saw one set that uses two lines instead of the three the bike comes with (one down to a splitter, then two from there to the brakes vs. two lines from the master cyl.) i was wondering what effects this has on braking?

    i would like less effort with the front brake, it takes three fingers and a good amount of strength to haul my bike down. my buddies r6 is a one finger affair, hell my old kz felt like it required less effort (although it has been a while) any other mods that would help me towards better front braking?

    thanks for the help.

    -Tyler

  • #2
    The stainless lines dont make it any easier to pull they just give you a better feel.
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    • #3
      Oh yeah. 2 lines is better than 1 run to a splitter. Go for it! Were you looking at Spiegler lines? Also, EBC HH+ pads will help you stop, too.

      Of course, the upgrades don't do much if your calipers aren't in good condition to begin with. Make sure your pistons are clean and moving freely.
      -Steve

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      • #4
        I also have been looking at this up grade. you definitely can't go wrong with stainless steel and 2x lines. the splitter is the weak link in the Kat brake set up. HH pads are also another great upgrade.
        http://www.spieglerusa.com/
        http://www.spieglerusa.com/cfm/brakelines.cfm
        TDA Racing/Motorsports
        1982 Honda CB750 Nighthawk, 1978 Suzuki GS750 1986 Honda CBR600 Hurricane; 1978 Suzuki GS1100E; 1982 Honda CB750F supersport, 1993 Suzuki Katana GSX750FP. 1981 Suzuki GS1100E (heavily Modified) http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=94258
        Who knows what is next?
        Builder of the KOTM Mreedohio september winning chrome project. I consider this one to be one of my bikes also!
        Please look at this build! http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=91192

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        • #5
          Spiegler lines make a HUGE difference even with stock pads. and they're made about 5 minutes from where i live.




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          • #6
            Where the heck were you guys about a month ago when I was going crazy trying to find lines?!?!

            I just put on a Goodridge stainless front 2 line kit with HH pads. Best thing I've done for the Kat yet! Just takes a light touch of the finger to slow it waaaaay down fast! I do believe that if I grabbed a handful I'd stand it on end. Very simple mod to do (takes like 3 tools) and highly recommended for our underbraked beasts. Stainless lines are worth every penny spent on them but if they aren't in the budget just replacing yoru stock lines should show improvement. Cyberpoet has the numbers but I believe they should be replace every 4 years, failed or not.
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            • #7
              That was the first mod on my bike...and I'd like to add that doint SS rears is a waste of money unless you need to replace the lines anyways.

              I also took my calipers apart (sounds hard, but it's wicked easy) and cleaned and regreased the pistons with some good marine grease I have and WOW, that actually made a better difference in brake speed...whereas the lines gave me better pressure.

              OH, and motul brake fluid rocks.

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              • #8
                BraadaJim
                Dude! I posted quite a bit about adding the brake lines when I was having lots of front brake problems. I also posted what a good deal I got on them!! (from 58cycle.com)
                +1 to the goodridge..
                I can now stop with just one finger and with stock pads!

                however
                It was a bit of a bear getting them to run right.
                They just didn't seem to want to drop in the right spot. I'm wondering if my set was meant to go:
                One line from MC to caliper then from one caliper to the other? I've seen some done this way.
                Also the rear one didn't want to run right at all. Even though it was listed as Pre 98 rear.
                I ended up running it along the torque linkage instead of the swing arm. Looks good and runs straight that way..

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by BraadaJim
                  Where the heck were you guys about a month ago when I was going crazy trying to find lines?!?!

                  I just put on a Goodridge stainless front 2 line kit with HH pads. Best thing I've done for the Kat yet! Just takes a light touch of the finger to slow it waaaaay down fast! I do believe that if I grabbed a handful I'd stand it on end. Very simple mod to do (takes like 3 tools) and highly recommended for our underbraked beasts. Stainless lines are worth every penny spent on them but if they aren't in the budget just replacing yoru stock lines should show improvement. Cyberpoet has the numbers but I believe they should be replace every 4 years, failed or not.
                  Yup...
                  The factory (and industry) specs are to replace the brake lines every 4 years, because they do flex with wheel movements (up/down/left/right) and simultaneously leak their VOC's over time, getting more brittle. Caliper seals should be changed at the same time, or whenever you swap pads, whichever comes first, for exactly the same basic reasons.
                  Change brake fluid every other year in most places, every year in high humidity environments because humidity in the air passes through brake lines (slowly, but it does), fouling the brake fluid.

                  Stock lines are made from rubber with nylon weave. Over time, the rubber gets bloated as the nylon gives way from being expanded under pressure over and over. Steel and/or kevlar lines flex less, because metal doesn't stretch out at the rate nylon does, thus keeping the pressure from the brake control reaching the caliper interface better. A teflon inner lining greatly reduces the penetration rate for humidity into the brake fluid (but doesn't eliminate it totally).

                  As for brake pads, stock OEM pads are GG rated. The first letter is grabbiness when cold, the second when hot. A popular upgrade is HH rated pads (the highest rating on the market at this time, any pad over 55% friction rate qualifies -- whether it's 56% or 85%, it's still HH). EBC HH pads on mine all around and SS lines; very little effort for a lot of stopping power. Note that HH pads should NOT be used for track events, where you are constantly on the brakes going into turns, because the increased friction rate also translates into much higher heat build-up; for track events or those who brake a lot (say every 1/4 mile or less), GG or even FF rated pads would be more ideal because of the heat issue.

                  SPECIAL NOTES:
                  New riders should NOT use HH rear pads because the increase in grip can easily cause the rear end to slide during panic reactions, increasing the odds of wiping out. Stick to the stock GG rated pads in such situations.
                  If using EBC rear pads, remove the factory brake pad shims before installing them -- they are designed to work without the rear shims in place.
                  Brake rotors often get grimey on bikes because of exposure to road oils, etc. -- wipe your finger over your rotor or wheels and expect that your rotors are similarly dirty. Spraying your rotors down once a week with either spray brake cleaner (direct application) or even just windex on a paper towel will help keep the oily-grime levels down and keep the brake bite up. Make it part of your standard pre-ride checklist.

                  Cheers
                  =-= The CyberPoet
                  Remember The CyberPoet

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                  • #10
                    I dunno what you guys are whining about . I can stop PLENTY fast with 2 fingers . I got some HH pads , and I'm sure that helps a bit . The biggest thing I've heard about the SS lines I like is that they give you better "feel" when trying to modulate the breaks .
                    I am a fluffy lil cuddly lovable bunny , dammit !



                    Katrider's rally 2011 - md86

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                    • #11
                      Oh, and I use a three line set-up in the front. I can't tell the difference between a two line and three line application in terms of performance with SS lines, HH pads and top-notch brake fluids... But that just may be me :P

                      Cheers
                      =-= The CyberPoet
                      Remember The CyberPoet

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                      • #12
                        MD, when you can see the brake lines flex, that is a bad thing. that means that preasure that should be going to the calipers is being transfered into the flex of the line.
                        TDA Racing/Motorsports
                        1982 Honda CB750 Nighthawk, 1978 Suzuki GS750 1986 Honda CBR600 Hurricane; 1978 Suzuki GS1100E; 1982 Honda CB750F supersport, 1993 Suzuki Katana GSX750FP. 1981 Suzuki GS1100E (heavily Modified) http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=94258
                        Who knows what is next?
                        Builder of the KOTM Mreedohio september winning chrome project. I consider this one to be one of my bikes also!
                        Please look at this build! http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=91192

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by THAZKAT
                          MD, when you can see the brake lines flex, that is a bad thing. that means that preasure that should be going to the calipers is being transfered into the flex of the line.
                          and it gets progessively worse as the brakes heat up and the heat transfers up the line. You will notice brake fade as the brakes seems to be firm when you come onto it, and then the pressure seems to get "soft" in the lever. It sucks and and I hate it. SS lines are on the agenda for my rebuild.

                          Thanks for posting the links. I was having a hard time finding some for the 1100. Spiegler has the rear, clutch and 3 front lines for $270....a bit more than I expected, but still a good investment.
                          I don't have a short temper. I just have a quick reaction to bullshit.




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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Mojoe
                            I was having a hard time finding some for the 1100. Spiegler has the rear, clutch and 3 front lines for $270....a bit more than I expected, but still a good investment.
                            You should be able to also walk into any hydraulic equipment company or your local NAPA auto parts store and have them custom made on the spot (24 hour turn around at NAPA), and they may be cheaper.

                            Cheers
                            =-= The CyberPoet
                            Remember The CyberPoet

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by The CyberPoet
                              Originally posted by Mojoe
                              I was having a hard time finding some for the 1100. Spiegler has the rear, clutch and 3 front lines for $270....a bit more than I expected, but still a good investment.
                              You should be able to also walk into any hydraulic equipment company or your local NAPA auto parts store and have them custom made on the spot (24 hour turn around at NAPA), and they may be cheaper.

                              Cheers
                              =-= The CyberPoet
                              I was thinking of that also. I will look into it when the time comes. There is a SS cltch line on ebay that no one has bid on yet...made just for my bike. You can be sure I am bidding on it.
                              I don't have a short temper. I just have a quick reaction to bullshit.




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