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The definitive Katana EFI swap thread

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  • BrianT
    replied
    Sounds like a project I'd like to try ... if I had the money, time, and skills to do it.

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    I found a spec sheet for various GSXR throttles. The 98-99 750s are huge, with an outer diameter of 54mm. There's absolutely no way those will fit, but the 01-03 generation looks like it'd be perfect. I'm going to measure a whole bunch of stuff on the katana and compare it to the gsxr to see if the throttles I have on the kat would fit. I'm going for zero cutting and welding this time around.

    One last thing I forgot to mention. This bike uses a TRUE CDI type system. The primary coil voltage is around 200v iirc. That'll fry the megasquirt, so the tach wire hopefully is compatible. If its not then ill have no choice but to buy the more expensive MS and try to capture the VR signal.
    Last edited by TheSteve; 06-21-2009, 04:43 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    That would probably work. The pump looked like the standard cylinder type, just maybe a hair smaller than a cars. I'm sure just about any bike pump will fit

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  • scottynoface
    replied
    Maybe you can retro an older zx7 fuel pump?

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    I may start a new thread on it pretty soon once I start buying stuff. It does look like on the 98-99 750s the throttle bodies were HUGE so I'm not sure ill be able to fit them. Ill probably be best off with the same throttles as before. Ill keep looking around.

    I did find that there are almost none of those fuel pumps available. Bikebandit has them for about $600 so that's out of the question. I may be able to fit a car's pump in the tank with a small bracket to hold it upright.

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  • sonosam
    replied
    I'm with Cheriff on this one. Go for it. I would love to do something like this to the Kat when I get the money and reading along for an older GSXR would be an interesting read. (for me anyway)

    Marc

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  • Cheriff
    replied
    I say do it. I wouldn't mind reading along as you work on another one of these projects And you have another bike you can ride so its not like you will be putting yourself out if it takes a while to get this one finished.

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    Well guys I may be at it again. About 3 weeks ago a new toy dropped into my hands. It's a 1997 GSXR 600. Heres some pics:





    It's carbed, but it DOES run, and it runs pretty well. It has a full Yoshi system, geared up a ton (annoyingly so even), and a jetkit (factory pro as far as I can tell). It starts every time and runs nicely, but it has massive lean surging during freeway cruising and slight surging around town. I raised the jet needles to their highest setting and the low speed surging stopped but the freeway issues still remain just enough to be annoying. Unfortunately I don't have the remainder of the jet kit, only what was installed when I got it. Without other jets to toy around with theres not much I can do beyond what I've tried.

    Now I'm faced with a dilemma. Do I simply buy the jets required and tinker till I'm satisfied? Or do I provide more entertainment/reading material for you guys and do another EFI swap? Monetairly, getting the proper jets is best. But if you've been following this thread you'll know that money isn't the driving factor for me in something like this.

    Since all the pros/cons of EFI are already pretty well known and I likely already have my mind made up I'll start with a few facts:

    96-99 GSXRs (known as the SRAD generation) were mostly carbed.
    All 600s were carbed.
    In 1998, Suzuki started offering the 750 as EFI.
    Bearing largely the same engine, I figure the 750 throttles will fit into the 600 intakes.
    If I'm wrong, I can retrofit the 01-03 generation's 600 throttles as I did with the Kat.
    Intake boot spacing appears to be 82mm between all four cylinders. Cam chain is on the end, unlike the katana.
    I don't currently know the intake boot diameter. Haven't had to pull the carbs off yet.
    Theres TONS of room underneath the carbs, I should have no problem fitting anything there.
    All SRADs had electric fuel pumps. Only the EFI models had high pressure pumps, but they should fit the tank the same (in tank pump)
    Stock carbs are Mikuni BDSR36. FSM says the bore is 36.5mm, boots are LIKELY in the 38mm area.

    So with that knowledge, I find myself once again considering an EFI conversion. It shouldn't cost very much, the 98-99 throttles are very rare, but seem to sell for $140. MS1 again, $140. Can't find the correct pump right now, but I'm sure one will show for $50ish. Between the 750 throttles probably fitting, the 01-03 600 throttle spacing being identical, and the in-tank pump it should make for a very easy and CLEAN swap. Theres even a spacious trunk on this bike. It's practically begging to be megasquirted. What do you guys think?
    Last edited by TheSteve; 06-21-2009, 03:08 AM.

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    I believe they were 36mm for the gsxr 600. The 1000 is even bigger.

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  • jamesbm1001
    replied
    those are the reasons that I was considering making my own, I have the tools/experience, and then ease of use. With a big enough throttle body you should be able to match flow of the individual units. What is the size of the gsxr throttle bodies? (mm's) I know I saw it somewhere but can't find it again.

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    Honestly that was the route I was going to take before I found out how similar the GSXR throttles were to the kats carbs in sizing. It'd make it much easier to tune and you'd never have to worry about syncing. It'd be much easier to turbo as well if that's something you were considering. If you can weld and fabricate you could probably make a pretty effective intake manifold. You could also tune the powerband some by making intake runners of different lengths and seeing what gives the most favorable torque curve. The only possible downside would be that its hard to match the flow and throttle response of the indepent throttle bodies.

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  • jamesbm1001
    replied
    would there be a downside to using an intake manifold with individual injectors and a single throttle body? I'm reasonably farmiliar with these systems from owning a honda del sol and tinkering around under the hood of that thing. I was just thinking that it may streamline the process. Any thoughts?

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    Wasted spark is an ignition system where the two "paired" cylinders share an ignition coil. So the two cyls that have a common TDC spark at the same time, with one being TDC on the compression stroke and the other TDC on the exhaust stroke. Its relatively easy to control since you only need a crank trigger wheel which the Kat motor already has.

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  • jamesbm1001
    replied
    just clarifying, what does "wasted spark" mean? I have a pretty good idea but want to make sure.

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  • TheSteve
    replied
    Actually both of those were answered already lol. You might be able to get away with a remapped ECU, but every single sensor has to be in place and showing correct values. It really depends on how much you can remap on it. You'd need to change the temp values since these oil cooled motors run so much hotter. You'd need to find an ecu that uses dual coils like the kat, unless you fit the new quad coil ignition from whatever bike to the katana engine. basically everything would have to be a perfect match, and even then it may be easier with the "generic" MS setup thats not expecting anything so specific.

    MS can do timing, however I didn't bother. On a kat with its wasted spark setup it wouldnt be too hard to do either. I may change mine someday if I run out of other projects. There are benefits to be had for sure.

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