Why does everybody hate the Battlax?

[nedfunnell]

Last fall I ordered some Battlax BT45V tires for my 88 Pre- the reviews looked good, they were affordable and my size. Now I read on here they're scum of the earth. Why?

[mammut89]

because its a bias tire.

read here :

http://www.motorcycleanchor.com/Katana/kat_tires.html

[scottynoface]

Because anyone who has ridden on them knows they have the grip of a greased up pig, are harder than Michael Jackson at a Jonas Brothers concert, and wear so unevenly that they make bicycle tires seem like an improvement.

Absolute junk.

[zuma]

However, they are fine for touring where you aren't going pseudo-Rossi and aren't trying to be popular.

[Nero]

However, they are fine for touring where you aren't going pseudo-Rossi and aren't trying to be popular.

[mreedohio]

Why to NEVER run Bias-tires on a Kat if you don't have to...
(i.e. - why to use radials)

Bias motorcycle tires contain plastic belts of some sort (nylon is common, polyester, dacron and others less commonly). Although a distinct improvement over prior tires (those built with cotton and other naturally occuring threads or no threads at all -- pre 1940's), bias tires do not compare well to modern metal-belted radial tires.
Although it can be said that radial belts can be made of plastics (and that bias belting can be made with metals), to the best of my knowledge, all currently offered radial motorcycle tires have metal belts of some form (steel, kevlar, etc) and all bias motorcycle tires utilize plastic-based belting.

Bias tires offer some serious draw-backs compared to metal-belted radials (and these are the reasons virtually every non-cruiser bike now sold spec's radial tires as stock fitment, as do many of the cruisers):

Shape retention at rapid depressurization.
THIS IS THE CRITICAL ONE.
Plastic threads have good tensile strength, but very little compression strength or form memory. When your tire gets seriously punctured at speed and loses pressure very quickly, bias tires tend to result in very nasty spills because the tire deforms immediately. Metal belted radials transfer the load into the metal belts and retain their shape normally long enough to come to a full and complete stop, even with very major damages, which can be a serious lifesaver.
A specific example from one of our own at KR/KP (told as exactingly as I can remember): one of our members was running at high speed through the Eiffel forest (lies at the eastern border of Germany and what is now the public road used to be used as a race track) when, while pitched over hard, his tire hit a large piece of jagged metal debris from a truck at speeds of about 85 mph. The hole the debris cut was about 3/4" across and about 6" in length, across the edge of the tread area and well into the sidewall area. If I recall correctly, he was two-up at the time as well. Because of the steel belting, his tire held up well enough to slow, clear the turn and come to a complete stop safely. If he had been on the bias tires he had been running just three weeks earlier (before I told him never to run bias tires and why), he and his passenger would almost assuredly be dead.

Weight, and handling/braking prowess
Although nylon and polyester weigh less than steel, the ability to use far thinner steel threads to acheive the same strength normally represents a total weight savings in the tire construction, which improves handling, braking and acceleration.

Heat distribution.
The contact patch of the tire generates heat as it comes past the road and deflects upon contact, then again when it bends back to it's original shape. Plastic threading is a poor carrier of heat, while metal is good carrier by comparison. Thus, metal-belted tires warm up quicker, and run cooler over-all because the heat generated spreads through the carcass much more evenly, while bias tires will create localized heat build-up that can lead to earlier failures, accelerated wear and even delamination in cases of being under-pressurized.

OEM Spec in the sizes you want to run
Because the OEM specifications for most years Katana's is specifically radials, and Suzuki specifically warns against using bias tires on those bikes (I believe bias tires shipped stock through '95, at which time the entire line-up was changed to radials -- though I'm not sure of the year break for it). The fact that the earlier Kats can run radials is just a boon for them -- make the switch, gain the benefits.

Better Grip at High Speeds
Because radials excert a better grip factor at speed (if using identical tread compounds and shapes) due to the rotational outward pressure of the metal belting. This also makes for a smoother ride and better contact patch rentention over slightly uneven surfaces (better at sucking up minor irregularities such as 1/16th to 1/8th inch imperfections at the road surface) at speeds above about 60 mph, as welll as providing less kick-back under heavy braking. Bias tires do tend to provide smoother rides at lower speeds.

Better Straight Line Stability
Radials provide better straight-line stability at high speeds due to the directional nature of the belt windings.

Better Fuel MileageBecause radials provide slightly improved fuel mileage (due primarily to being able to transmit more contact to the road while minimizing rolling resistance).

No Z-Rated Bias Tires exist
No one makes Z-rated bias motorcycle tires (as far as I know), which is the speed rating called for on the Katana due to a combination of load weights and heat build-up. Generally, most bias tires cap off at H ratings, although some manufacturers do now make V rated bias tires for smaller-sized (generally 500cc and smaller) bikes.

Where the R&D Dollars Go
And finally, because no major tire manufacturer is putting any serious research into bias tires at our tire sizes, concentrating their R&D efforts on radials in specific sizes which represent the direction of the market and racing efforts about the globe. Thus, in general, bias tires are old-technology, not benefiting from the newest R&D, unlike the better radials on the market.

for the slow kids

[Kreylyn]

Because anyone who has ridden on them knows they have the grip of a greased up pig, are harder than Michael Jackson at a Jonas Brothers concert, and wear so unevenly that they make bicycle tires seem like an improvement.

Absolute junk.

The hints of truth in this are what make it so funny!...

Krey

[scottynoface]

The hints of truth in this are what make it so funny!...

Krey

I had them on my 600, just callin it like I see it

[Black_peter]

I think until you've used a "good" tire you don't know what you have been missing
(like grip)
Once you fit a pair of superior tires like the Conti. or such you will be like:

[GSXF 600 Guy]

When I first got my bike, I had Battlax's on it. They seemed good until I had them replaced with the Conti RA's. Then I realized they are junk tires. If you are worried about price, Conti has a few different tires. I had to go cheap for the set i got on it now. Ended up with the Conti Motions. Alright tire.. Pleanty of grip & not rock hard. Will get me through a season or 2 without question.

[chrisgreer23]

I think until you've used a "good" tire you don't know what you have been missing
(like grip)
Once you fit a pair of superior tires like the Conti. or such you will be like:

AMEN. For the longest time I was debating this with the wif. I started on a Kat 600 with stock tires. The Kat was my first bike EVER so I had nothig to compare it with. I had never used anything other then the stock tires and always believed that I wouldn't be able to tell how bad the stock ones were unless I had tried a different tire.

The wif had Pirelli Scorpions on her Kat and I did ride that sometimes but thats besides the point. To be honest I couldn't really tell the difference. Then again I lived in the UK and riding weather was sparse. Roads were awesome tho

[Nero]

Tires are a preference thing, and then there's the bike. Naturally, different bikes demand different set-up. I really couldn't wait for the stock tires on my '14 to wear off (fortunately, that never takes long. ). Tried the contis and the rubber wore off of those way too fast. I think I got 2600 miles off of the rear tire. For a '14 or a 'Busa, you've got to give up some of the sticky stuff unless you plan on buying tires in bulk and switching them out like you're in a NASCAR race. I run Avon Storms now and I seem to get about 3500 miles out of a rear tire now, which is good for this bike.

[arsenic]

best description EVER!

Nero, that is a way gay profile pic brother.

Because anyone who has ridden on them knows they have the grip of a greased up pig, are harder than Michael Jackson at a Jonas Brothers concert, and wear so unevenly that they make bicycle tires seem like an improvement.

Absolute junk.

[thetable]

However, they are fine for touring where you aren't going pseudo-Rossi and aren't trying to be popular.

Meh, wouldn't go that far, they don't last as long, and they don't offer the grip of modern tires. Yeah, I'll run bias ply tires... on my KLR.

[steves]

Here is my BT-021 after a hard few thousand miles of highway riding.



It squared off easy. I probably could have run this tire another thousand or so miles... but they were slow to warm up, gave crappy feedback, and turned slow.

I mounted a set of Pilot Road 2s, I have not abused them with a long distance slab ride yet but they have yet to square off, peel, or ball up in the abuse that I have handed them.

The bottom line, is that all tires are not created equal.

The Battleax's I've run are less then equal including one or two BT-45s on the bandit.