Brother isn't listening

[nightmare]

Ok...here's my situation:

My brother has been talking recently about getting a motorcycle (which, of course, I'm happy to hear). However, he is saying that he wants to get a ninja 636 or a ninja 650. I told him that he should read the article by Chris Sedition that I posted recently on how to pick a first bike. After I showed him several new possibilities (including the Kat, SV650, GS500, and the two small ninjas) as well as some early 90's bikes ('92 ZZR600 looks really sharp to me, and the old CBR's), he basically disregarded everything I was saying to him and simply said "I'll get the bike I want". Basically, he said that he doesn't like the way any of the other bikes look and he only wants the ninja 650 or ninja 636.

So my question is this: Is the 650 or 636 too big for him to start on? I personally thought so, but I want to hear from some people with more experience.

Also, what are some very sporty looking bikes that are gentle enough for a beginner? I think my brother is getting stuck on looks so if I could find a really fantastic looking 500 or an older 600 maybe he'll change his mind.

Thanks for any assistance you guys can offer!

- J

[woobie]

Your facing an uphill battle, if he has buddies that ride you could hope they will help out with the less powerful bike arguement. But it's seems pretty close to an even split that you'll either hear "get a small bike to learn" or "get a super sport and just becareful"

If he's dead set on those bikes good luck trying to sway him. Personally I've always liked the looks of a lot of older bikes over the newer ones, The old FZR is one sexy looking bike IMHO lol.

Up here we have the high cost of insuring a SuperSport to deter many new riders. A lot of area's in the States seem to have super low insurance rates so it makes it that much easier for a newb to buy a SS.

In the meantime though you could try to get him to at least go gear shopping so if he does choose a SS as a first bike he'll be prepared "just in case". I would assume mesh or perforated leather would be best down in Florida.

Other than that get him to sign up for the MSF course or any other rider training available.

[allblackkat]

Make sure he takes the MSF course. Tell him the Ninja 650 is way cooler than the 636, (cuz it's really the safer of the two. If thats possible in the hands of a noob.) 75hp on the 650 compared to 125hp on the 636...

The 650 is really just a step up from the ninja 500..
I would've gotten it for my wife as her first bike after we took the MSF course.... It's lighter than the 500..

Throw a motogp style exhaust on that thing and it sounds sweet.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GQPbMRIy0s&NR=1

But def no go on the 636... It is lighter than the 650 and is way too much bike, and less forgiving.

[LocoKat]

Nightmare,I bought a 636 two weeks ago and decide to sell it (too fast),I'm getting another KAT this week,your brother can see the bike in Craigslist (Orlando).

[87vert]

make sure he takes the MSF before buying the bike. The MSF might help sway him to a different bike. Thought it might also instill a false convidence. "Hey I can ride these bikes just fine so I could ride any bike just fine"

make sure he gets the gear also.

Make sure to tell him not to buy a new bike as a first bike.

[KatanaSoldier]

Man this is tough because he is blood! Man, in honesty, I think the throttle is too unforgiving for a new rider. Just my opinion though.

[KatanaSoldier]

No way to talk him out of it?

[tdrcomm]

+1000 to all the above.

Unfortunately, there's nothing that looks as cool as the supersports or "R" bikes under 600cc's (in my opinion). The Ninja 500 looks cool if you strip it and make it a naked streetfighter, and I like the fully-faired SV and the Kawi 650 (it does sound sweet with the right exhaust).

Tell him to get the best gear he can afford and pray for the best. The 636 is NOT a forgiving bike for a newbie.

[Black_peter]

If he were my brother I would just stop by his house every night and pull off a part of whatever he bought ..
One day clutch lever, next day shift lever..

Lucky my brother rides a Harley.. So worst case he's too poor from the repair bills to buy the beer.

[nightmare]

If he were my brother I would just stop by his house every night and pull off a part of whatever he bought ..
One day clutch lever, next day shift lever..

Ah ok...so the 650 is what I should guide him towards (if he won't listen to anything else).

I definately won't tell him about the horsepower difference, though

Thanks alot for all of the advice...I was really getting worried that by brother would be counted among the squids who have died on a bike that was too fast. I'm definately pushing the MSF course on him and I'm hoping he'll at least let me give him some pointers on some of the basics...

...I was really hoping he would just love the pre-98 kat so I would get to ride it

I have another question: since the 650 is obviously not an SS bike, how does it compare to the Kat in terms of weight?

[Black_peter]

If he were my brother I would just stop by his house every night and pull off a part of whatever he bought ..
One day clutch lever, next day shift lever..

I wasn't joking...

[JZ67]

You know your brother best. If you don't think he can respect the power of the SS bikes and control his wrist you should plainly let him know what your position is without being overbearing. Show him that you care about his well being. You lecture him and he won't listen.

Perhaps let him take your bike for a spin so he can see for himself that the HP number is not the most relevant factor.

MSF course - no doubt in my mind. As woobie said, take him gear shopping. Perhaps being helpful will play on his mind how serious you are about his safety.

Check out the local Kawi dealers with him and find out when or if Kawi is setting up an event day locally so he can ride both bikes.

I saw a program about a place in Daytona called "Destination Daytona". All my web searches show it is HD driven but I swear they had a Yami dealer that has daily demo rides - did not see if Kawi or Suzuki was represented. It is only two hours from you so you guys could make a day of it. Damn, I swear they interviewed a guy that just tested an FJR1300.

Good luck.

[md86]

Remind him how much theives LOVE them SS bikes , too . Usually , I just roll up my sleave and show my cool "tatoo" from my wreck a few years ago to get their attention , then go on to explain how just about ANY bike they get no matter the cc's will be faster than the Civic they wish they could be as fast as . And if they STILL don't listen , ask for first dibs on their parts . When they ask "what parts" , say "the parts that'll be left when you wreck your bike because it's too much for you" .

[fadeykin]

I rode the Kawa 650 before buying the Kat 600 last summer and as a fairly new rider I can tell you that I found it very forgiving and easy to get along with. Ride height and position felt really good (I'm 6', 165lbs) and the power was very managable. Similar to the Kat in some respects and if not a little more tourque'ish.

Just as a side note, I went the Kat in the end, after testing both bikes I really felt like the Kat was a better bike overall, but that's just me.

On the hand, I've ridden a friends 636 and as cool and fun as it was, I got off in 5 minutes. I knew right away I didn't have the experience or the know-how to really enjoy the ride for what it is and what it should be.

I have a few friends that ride and two summers ago when I said I was going for my motorcycle license all of them said the same thing about getting my first bike, go reasonable, alloy yourself time to learn but make sure you have fun.

Plus everyone basically told me that if I bought a bike that was over my head they'd steal it.

My oppinion, do what you can, no matter what. Fact is, this isn't a toy, no matter how fun they are. If something bad happens on a bike, there is an awefully good chance that he would die. We've all seen it happen.

[Range]

basically...he is buying the name "Ninja", as he has no idea that both bikes are very dissimilar.