600 to 750 swingarm. First Post

[91katguy]

Im new to motorcycles and picked up a 91 kat 600 the other day. It runs great but i noticed the chain was really loose. To my suprise, the sprocket bolts had been rubbing the swingarm. the adjuster tabs are bent so they are no good and the swingarm is trash. Locally i have found a 91 750 kat swingarm and know thats its 1.5 inches longer. Can i use my same chain or would i have to buy another one thats longer? Also, i cant figure out why the sprocket ws rubbing in the first place. Everything seems to be in place and assembled correctly , so if anyone has any ideas let me kno. Thanks

[arsenic]

You'd have to buy a longer chain. The old swingarm could be bent. The sprocket hub isn't seated correctly. Something is making the angle of that wrong. The sprocket nuts aren't supposed to be that close to the swingarm to rub.

http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=116291

[91katguy]

ok i'll pull the swingarm tonight and check for straightness but its trashed anyway. haha. Is there supposed to be a spacer between the bearing in the sprocket and the swingarm? The bearing on mine is right up against the swingarm

[Kreylyn]

The OEM kat spacer that goes between the swingarm and sprocket carrier is only 9.5mm wide. It seats so far in that about 1mm is sticking out. This normally isn't an issue with the OEM carrier.

If everything is present, and accounted for... It might be someone swapped the sprocket bolts or something of that nature. There isn't alot of clerance for error.

Pictures of what is going on might help us spot something. If you have them... take some as you take the wheel off.

If you swap swingarms, you will need 4 more links on the chain. You can't just add them to the existing one, but that will give you an idea of how many links you need. I generally suggest getting a 120 and just cut it to size.

Krey

[arsenic]

REAR WHEEL MODEL K L M N P R S T

[91katguy]

I'll try to get some pics. i didnt see any kind of spacer tho. deos it seat back in the bearing?

[Kreylyn]

I'll try to get some pics. i didnt see any kind of spacer tho. deos it seat back in the bearing?

As you can see in this pic, the stock spacer sits almost flush with the carrier.



In the center there all the "metal" is the spacer, the surrounding black is a plastic dust sheild.

Here you can see the OEM spacer for the Pre kats was not very large at all...






The replacement spacers are now around 14mm wide. This means you would probably need to spread the forks slightly to fit it all in with a new spacer, but it would give you more clearance.

Krey

[91katguy]

by looking at your pic i dont think mine has a spacer or the dust cover. when i took the wheel off there was a super thin piece of metal covering the bearings. it fell off when i took the wheel off. i didnt have the spacer or the blcak plastic. i appreciate yalls help im glad i joined this forum

[stephenspann27]

I finally bolted up the '88 600 swing arm to my '90 750. I did this so that I could have a shorter wheel base. I was told this was a direct swap.. however there are quiet a few differences. The swing arm pivot bolts are different sizes. The main square tube part of the 600 swing arm is way smaller than the 750, so the 750 chain adjusters do not work. And the final difference is that the 750 swing arm is about 1/8'' wider where the wheel bolts in. In order to get the wheel to fit I ground some material off the brake caliper plate.. this was a bad idea.. What is strange is that the part #'s for the brake caliper adapter plate, and the spacer between the wheel bearing and caliper plate are the same for both the 600 are the same. I'm wondering if maybe the used swing arm is bent maybe? I need help..

Is the rear brake caliper a true dual piston caliper where both sides move? Or does it have just one piston that pushes against a stationary pad.. ?

[Kreylyn]

I finally bolted up the '88 600 swing arm to my '90 750. I did this so that I could have a shorter wheel base. I was told this was a direct swap.. however there are quiet a few differences. The swing arm pivot bolts are different sizes. The main square tube part of the 600 swing arm is way smaller than the 750, so the 750 chain adjusters do not work. And the final difference is that the 750 swing arm is about 1/8'' wider where the wheel bolts in. In order to get the wheel to fit I ground some material off the brake caliper plate.. this was a bad idea.. What is strange is that the part #'s for the brake caliper adapter plate, and the spacer between the wheel bearing and caliper plate are the same for both the 600 are the same. I'm wondering if maybe the used swing arm is bent maybe? I need help..

Is the rear brake caliper a true dual piston caliper where both sides move? Or does it have just one piston that pushes against a stationary pad.. ?

The pivot bearings are the same size, so to swap the swingarm you use the pivot hardware from your OLD swingarm in the new one... and everything should fit right in.

I'm not aware of the tubing being smaller. This is a new one to me. Perhaps 88 was the only year like this?

Everyone seems to think the proper way to fit things into the swingarm is to start cutting and trimming spacers and such. That was wrong, very wrong. You should have simple spread the swingarm the 1/8" you needed to fit the wheel and parts in. Used parts get bent, it's not uncommon for people to forget spacers and bolt down the wheel only to realize it and put the spacer back in... to find the swingarm is not collapsed smaller and it's a pain to get it in.

The used arm can very well be bent slightly, yes.

The caliper is dual piston, one on each side. It does not press against a plate.

So, back to the smaller tube and adjusters issue. If this is true, it's new to me and definately something to keep in mind. I know this is not true for 90-97 600s, they use the same tube as the 750s.

The 88 model bike is really a unique bike to it's own. There are alot of variances that the 88 and some 89 600s have that are completely different than the 90+ or 750s. Carbs, airbox, wiring harness, wheels, etc... so now possibly the swingarm too.

My recomendation... replace the caliper bracket you shaved with a good one, pick a differnt swingarm 90-97 in years. All your problems will probably go away.

Resell the one you got to recoup the majority of the funds spent on it, if not all (I always list stuff up for buy now more than I spent to buy and ship to me).

Krey

[stephenspann27]

The pivot bearings are the same size, so to swap the swingarm you use the pivot hardware from your OLD swingarm in the new one... and everything should fit right in.

I'm not aware of the tubing being smaller. This is a new one to me. Perhaps 88 was the only year like this?

Everyone seems to think the proper way to fit things into the swingarm is to start cutting and trimming spacers and such. That was wrong, very wrong. You should have simple spread the swingarm the 1/8" you needed to fit the wheel and parts in. Used parts get bent, it's not uncommon for people to forget spacers and bolt down the wheel only to realize it and put the spacer back in... to find the swingarm is not collapsed smaller and it's a pain to get it in.

The used arm can very well be bent slightly, yes.

The caliper is dual piston, one on each side. It does not press against a plate.

So, back to the smaller tube and adjusters issue. If this is true, it's new to me and definately something to keep in mind. I know this is not true for 90-97 600s, they use the same tube as the 750s.

The 88 model bike is really a unique bike to it's own. There are alot of variances that the 88 and some 89 600s have that are completely different than the 90+ or 750s. Carbs, airbox, wiring harness, wheels, etc... so now possibly the swingarm too.

My recomendation... replace the caliper bracket you shaved with a good one, pick a differnt swingarm 90-97 in years. All your problems will probably go away.

Resell the one you got to recoup the majority of the funds spent on it, if not all (I always list stuff up for buy now more than I spent to buy and ship to me).

Krey

The actual needle part of the bearing is the same size, but the collar that goes inside the bearing is for a smaller swing arm bolt.

It looks like the '88 600 swing arm is indeed different. I knew I had made sure the chain adjusters where the same part number before I bought the 600 swing arm, but when I head look up the 600 #'s I looked up a '90 model.

I will replace my caliper bracket with a ebay one. I guess I have a seized piston in my brake caliper because with the way it is offset now, one of the pads is dragging badly, when it should just recenter in its new position. I think I've been running it with a single piston working, which explains why its always been crappy. This is no surprise, the bike sat for 9 years before I got it, and I had to break free all of the pistons in the front calipers.

As for what to do next. I would really like to make this swing arm work, I hvae a lot of time in prep and paint. I think I'm going to try sticking a bottle jack in the swing arm and spreading it back the correct width.

As for chain adjusters.. I guess I could get bandit ones right?

I guess I could buy these adjusters: '88 specific http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Suzuk...item4153a8c1fc

[Kreylyn]

The actual needle part of the bearing is the same size, but the collar that goes inside the bearing is for a smaller swing arm bolt.

It looks like the '88 600 swing arm is indeed different. I knew I had made sure the chain adjusters where the same part number before I bought the 600 swing arm, but when I head look up the 600 #'s I looked up a '90 model.

I will replace my caliper bracket with a ebay one. I guess I have a seized piston in my brake caliper because with the way it is offset now, one of the pads is dragging badly, when it should just recenter in its new position. I think I've been running it with a single piston working, which explains why its always been crappy. This is no surprise, the bike sat for 9 years before I got it, and I had to break free all of the pistons in the front calipers.

As for what to do next. I would really like to make this swing arm work, I hvae a lot of time in prep and paint. I think I'm going to try sticking a bottle jack in the swing arm and spreading it back the correct width.

As for chain adjusters.. I guess I could get bandit ones right?

I guess I could buy these adjusters: '88 specific http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Suzuk...item4153a8c1fc

Those adjusters look different than any othe Kat adjusters I've seen. If you get the 88 specific ones, you probably have that problem solved.

The bandit adjusters and such are going to match the size on the later model Kats and be too big for that swingarm.

So the bearings are the same size on that swingarm as your 750 right? So you can just use the 750 pivot bolt and bushing in the new arm. That should be no issue then. Is this right?

A simple rebuild on the caliper may be all that is needed to resolve the issue. You might be able to find a cheaper caliper (perhaps even a pair with the bracket together ) for cheap though. It might still need a rebuild, but ...

Use some wood between the jack to prevent damaging the paint, and spreading it out a little bit should work just fine.

Krey

[stephenspann27]

Those adjusters look different than any othe Kat adjusters I've seen. If you get the 88 specific ones, you probably have that problem solved.

The bandit adjusters and such are going to match the size on the later model Kats and be too big for that swingarm.

So the bearings are the same size on that swingarm as your 750 right? So you can just use the 750 pivot bolt and bushing in the new arm. That should be no issue then. Is this right?

A simple rebuild on the caliper may be all that is needed to resolve the issue. You might be able to find a cheaper caliper (perhaps even a pair with the bracket together ) for cheap though. It might still need a rebuild, but ...

Use some wood between the jack to prevent damaging the paint, and spreading it out a little bit should work just fine.

Krey

yes I used the bushings from the 750 in the 600 swing arm and got it to work. i was just noting that difference.

I found a bracket for $9 so I bought that.. hopefully I can fix the caliper. I also bought those '88 adjusters I posted the link to.

[Kreylyn]

Part of doing mods is running into minor issues and "finds" like this. Sometimes there are changes and adjustments that make it a little more difficult, but ... that's part of the fun right?

Krey