Someone knocked over my bike the other day :(

[skotty]

Hey all,

Just wanted to vent a bit. I was in California last week, and for the whole week, my bike was chained to a pole in the parking lot where I live. My friend saw the bike laying on its side when he came home, he didnt tell me at the time, cause I was on a vacation (I am glad he didnt tell me, I would had nightmares for the whole vacation). When I came back, he told me that he found the bike laying down and that there was a phone number on the bike. I called that number, and a lady picked up, she said that her neice saw what happened, but wasnt there at the moment. I am desperately waiting for that girl to call me back and let me know what happened. The bike wasnt very badly damaged, the right rear foot peg snapped and there are a few scratches on the front fairing, but it hurts to see my Kat that way. I will post pics later and let you all know what happens.

[The CyberPoet]

If it hit hard, be cautious, one or more of the carb floats might stick (flooding it).

On a separate note, if it laid on it's side for any significant amount of time, you'll probably want to do an oil change as well (because of fuel from the carbs potentially having run into the oil).

Finally, before you start it, yank the plugs, drop a teaspoon of oil into each cylinder and without putting the plugs back, turn over the engine (either manually or with the starter) a couple times, so if there's a cylinder full of fuel it spews out rather than trying to compress a liquid & possibly doing additional damages.

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[skotty]

Wow, I didnt know that a fall could cause that many complications, I am glad you mentioned it, I will do that as soon as I get the time. From what I hear, the bike was probably down for about 45 minutes. One question though, how would I turn over the engine without putting the spark plugs back in? I thought I would need a spark from the spark plugs to get the motor started. Unless if you mean, that I put it in gear and try to move the bike front and back. Thanks for your input Cyber.

[ZukiFred]

Just leave the plugs out and hit the start switch, the starter will turn the engine over and blow Any excess fuel out threw the plug holes.

[The CyberPoet]

You don't need the engine to run -- you need the pistons to move up and down (to spew out any fluids inside of them). Thus, the spark plugs being out is critical. There are three ways that I know of to dry out a potentially wet (fuel-filled) cylinder:

1. Turn over the engine and let the rising piston force the fluid upwards & out (some will go out the exhaust, some will spew upwards out the spark plug hole). It's not crucial whether the engine is made to turn using the starter, by rotating the rear wheel in gear, or by using the timing signal rotor and a wrench (like you'd rotate it to adjust valves), although the starter will probably spin it the fastest and thus have the highest likeliness of getting most of the liquid out.

2. Vacuum -- a shop vac with a small enough adaptor to fit thru the spark plug hole for example. This is probably the most efficient method at getting it all out, but you have to be careful that fuel vapors won't explode from the sparks at the vacuum motor (usually only an issue on older shop vacs). If you go this route, put a couple cups of water with a half-cup of dish detergent in the bottom of the vac before you start, and put the vac as far from you & the bike as feasible, plus only do it outdoors (where if the vac does ignite, it won't cause secondary damages to the building).

3. Air evaporation. This is the old school method, and you just leave the plugs out for a day; works faster if you shove one end of a clean cotton rag down into each hole to act as a wick (how dry & warm the air is plays into how fast it evaporates).

Basically, when the bike fell over, the fuel in the carb float bowls went somewhere -- it might have migrated backwards into the airbox (check the airbox and air filter), or it might have migrated forwards into the engine itself (hence the oil change). 45 minutes is about 44 minutes longer than it would have taken the fuel to go where-ever it went...

Once you have all potential fuel out, oil changed, airbox cleared, set the gas tank to prime for 45 seconds to refill the carbs before trying to start the engine for real.

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[skotty]

Oh, didnt know that, thanks ZukiFred.

[Jax]

Cyber..when you turn over the engine without plugs in, this probably goes without really mentioning it but you never know, does it launch the liquid out or just pushes it up to the top? The reason I'm asking is we all have the habit of looking at whats happening (ie looking directly into the plug holes)...now if your face is near there and it shoots out it has the potential of spewing fuel in your face..doesn't feel good and burns the eyes...if it just sepes out then no danger but your face should still be away from the holes just in case...

[The CyberPoet]

Keep your face away!

I recommend you put a rag over the holes. The liquid, depending on the speed of the starter, can eject for as much as 15 - 20 feet...

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[Jax]

Ok that's what I wanted to know..good to point out maybe the obvious but you can never be too safe..

[Mojoe]

removing the plugs is overkill, imho.
if the bike has been sitting back upright for a day or so (even less time is required), the gas WILL just seep it's way down into the crankcase.
Just change the oil and you are fine.

I will bet you $5 that if it has been setting for a day, you will not get any gas coming out at all. And even if there is a bit in there, it will not hurt anything. People flood bikes often, and never have to remove the plugs if they just let it set for a while.

change the oil...YES.
remove the plugs.....not neccessary. it's overkill and time consuming. If you wheeled it into the dealers and told them all that happened....and you want them to get it running, all they will do is change the oil. I garantee it. If you REQUEST they remove the plugs, they will say "sure".....but probably won't and bill you for it anyway. They will just start it up.

[philwecksr]

On this note, I was out for a ride the other day, and when I stopped, I went to put it on the side stand and it toppled. It was only on its side for maybe 10-20 seconds before we righted it, but should I be changing the oil now?

[The CyberPoet]

it's overkill and time consuming.

The fuel is *probably* out of the cylinder. Still, I'm going to advise him to take the safest of all possible routes (which means fuel out and fresh oil into the cylinder wells, because fuel in the cylinder would have washed away any oil on the cylinder walls).

On this note, I was out for a ride the other day, and when I stopped, I went to put it on the side stand and it toppled. It was only on its side for maybe 10-20 seconds before we righted it, but should I be changing the oil now?

Debatable. If it were my bike, I'd do it...

Cheers,
=-= The CyberPoet

[Mojoe]

On this note, I was out for a ride the other day, and when I stopped, I went to put it on the side stand and it toppled. It was only on its side for maybe 10-20 seconds before we righted it, but should I be changing the oil now?

hell no.

too much paranoia going on here about this subject.
first of all, the gas isn't going to just go a flowing into the cylinders. it is drawn in during the intake stroke via a vacume. engine not running = no vacume. you can leave the bike on it's side for several minutes, and all you have to do is start it right up when you stand it back up. if you look real good at the carbs, they way they are shaped...if the bike is on it's side, the gas will flow out the front of the carbs and will seep out of the carbs onto the ground, or go into the airbox before it will actually go into the cylinders. Your front end would have to be pointing downhill for it to actually flow into the cyclinders. When a bike is on it's side on flat ground, the rear is usually sitting lower than the front, so the gas will usually flow out the front of the carbs.
Plus you have to consider something else....not all the intake valves are open at the same time.....so that alone prevents gas from going into all the cylinders. And even with the ones open, the way the intake is designed, it will "pool up" in the head before it actually overflows into the cylinder. YES...it can also flow in via the exhaust...but still, not all cyclinders will have the valve closest to the ground, open. one or 2 cylinders at the most will allow gas in. When you do try to start it, and most you will get a bit too much gas in the cylinder at start up, and will flood a bit....but should eventually start ok.
what will flow into the cyclinders is the oil from the crankcase.....and it will only flow into one......the cyclinder closest to the ground, because that is about all the oil level will reach.....but it has to be there a while.

45 minutes on it's side.....ya...do an oil change to be safe.....but do it after you start the bike WITHOUT removing the plugs...just to get the excess gas burnt off.

But this is your choice. Follow the advice you wish to follow. The only time I ever removed the plugs was ONLY when it was so flooded that it would not start on it's own. And when I did remove the plugs, I set a spark to the cylinder with the plug out to burn the gas off in one shot. bikes, skidoos, outboard motors.....did pretty much the same on all of them. you need a bit of balls to do that though, cuz sometimes you get a pretty good "whooomph!".......but it doesn't hurt anything. it's no different than a backfire. DON'T stick your face over it to see it...lol.

[philwecksr]

Oh no. Conflicting opinions from two of the handful of members I'll listen to without fail.... Hmmmm.....

[Mojoe]

well whatever option you choose to follow, don't neglect the air box. it is just as likely that gas will flow in that direction as it will into the cyclinders.....and in my opinion, even more of a chance. and if you try to start a flooded bike with gas in the airbox.....and it backfires out the intake....well, let's just hope you have a solid airbox.
my airbox on my old nighthawk had a side door for the filter, and it blew it open and a wicked-ass flame came shooting out. I was standing right beside it. it didn't do anything to me except that I felt a blast of pressure and a bit of heat...nothing more.