[Flip]

Re: Gas prices = more new riders...

fortunately they both said they were going to take the MSF ! I gave them some info and pointers about bikes and gear and congratulated both of them for being smart and taking the MSF beginners course

Nothing against those who took the MSF, but i got my learners permit, rode with friends, then passed the DMV road test and think i am a 100x better rider then those out of the MSF. In Virginia, i had to have my learners for a month beofre i could take the road test and i think i got out and rode with friends atleast 20x. Those crazies who take a WEEKEND course and get a FREE LISCENCE are the most dangerous SOB's i have ever seen. I spent a week in a parking lot then about 5 weeks in a pack only, you cant tell me people who have a weekend worths of riding deserve a liscence to ride alone. In Virginia, once you pass the MSF you get a liscence.... worst rule ever.

[Flip]

One time while i still had my learners me and a friend were out riding when we pulled behind a guy at a light who proceeded to stall out 3 times in a row before he got it going, he immediately pulled into the nearest parking lot. We followed him just to check to see if his bike was OK and running well.

When we got to talking he said he just got his liscence and was out for the 2nd time on his new bike, "Man, these 1000cc's are a lot easier to stall than the 250's we practiced on at the MSF!" he says as we roll out eyes. Here i was with a learners and could ride circles around the dude.

Why dont they use real, less lenient bikes at the MSF?

[WildKat]

The MSF is designed to give you the basic tools to know how to operate a motorcycle.. its not designed as a replacement for real world riding experience..but rather a tool to help you learn how to properly deal w/ real world riding.

[Flip]

The MSF is designed to give you the basic tools to know how to operate a motorcycle.. its not designed as a replacement for real world riding experience..but rather a tool to help you learn how to properly deal w/ real world riding.

Then they shouldnt give a liscence so eaily to the idiots who 'pass'.

[tzortn]

Re: Gas prices = more new riders...

Nothing against those who took the MSF, but i got my learners permit, rode with friends, then passed the DMV road test and think i am a 100x better rider then those out of the MSF. In Virginia, i had to have my learners for a month beofre i could take the road test and i think i got out and rode with friends atleast 20x. Those crazies who take a WEEKEND course and get a FREE LISCENCE are the most dangerous SOB's i have ever seen. I spent a week in a parking lot then about 5 weeks in a pack only, you cant tell me people who have a weekend worths of riding deserve a liscence to ride alone. In Virginia, once you pass the MSF you get a liscence.... worst rule ever.

I was one of those "crazies" that used the MSF to get my license. I can tell you for a fact that I am not a dangerous rider. Making generalizations like that is pretty bold on your part. You are lucky to have people to ride with. You are twice as lucky to have responsible people to ride with who taught you properly. I do not have freinds in the area that ride, so if I wanted to learn to ride legally I needed to get my license.

I have met more people who have developed bad habits while learning from friends than people who are dangerous riders after taking the MSF class. The guy particular case that you mention, the newbie with a liter bike, is over his head how ever he learned to ride. Newbies have no business on liter bikes. If anything all riders should be required to take the MSF and there should be tiered licensing. At least that is my opinion, but you know what they say about opinions.

[Lagmo]

lol, the 'newb' on liter bike syndrome dosn't exist here

To ride a bike in the first place...

1: You have to take 16 hours of theory, 12 hours of practise on the roads. 3 hours of basic manuevering, 4 hours advanced riding course and pass a physical.
You'll have to pass both a written test and a practical one as well.

2: You're only allowed to ride under the supervison and guidance of a licensed and registered instructor while learning.(learner permits don't exist)

3: If you're <21 you'll have to wait till you turn 21 or two years(whichever comes first) to ride anything with >34HP (you need to be 18 to get a license in the first place)

4: Typical license cost with just above mentioned is around ~1200-1500$ USD IF you get it on the first try.

5: You're under stricter rules when commiting a traffic offense for 3 years after you get your license.

6: Typical Liter bikes like the GSXR, R1 and CBR1000RR cost > 40K, a SV1000S will set you back about 21.000$

Ofcourse it dosn't mean we're SQUID free(far from it), just means the squids ride crappier bikes or they ride completely illegally; no insurrance, license nor plates and being squids: no gear