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Revived & Compression results

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  • Revived & Compression results

    After several years of sitting...
    5 minute warm up/ whiteish smoke begins to puff from left pipe on rev, but not on idle. The smoke dissipates and smells like gas (93 octane with Lucas upper cylinder lube). I also noticed a puff of smoke coming from under the #1 header flange or Head (That area) during rev. No exhaust leak heard so I'm thinking cracked head, head bolt or gasket. I also notice oil around the header/mid pipe connection clamp. I've not riden this bike, only about 7-8 easy warm ups. There is a Occasional pop from the pipes during revs, but not often. Experience tells me thats a lean condition but you guys are welcome to say. I checked all plugs (New) during compression test and they all seem in equal condition, a little blackish. So, here is the dry compression result after a 5 minute warm up (NEW Harbor Freight gauge).
    #1 #2 #3 #4
    160 160 135 165
    160 160 140 165
    160 160 140 160

    Second test, 5 minute cool down & fresh battery.

    165 165 155 175
    168 168 157 175


    I'm considering cleaning the carbs but I've never done it. All I have to go on is what I find here on the forums.

    Thanks guys

    Forgot to tell you all, the service manual says
    156-213 standard,
    any thing below 128psi requires rebuild,
    and any cylinder thats 28psi different requires rebuild.
    Last edited by katanarider; 12-17-2014, 05:47 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    My Katana-1100 17" wheel swap
    http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=136894

  • #2
    Looks fine to me, dry results are going to be a little lower. The repeats just helped everything get lubed/seated.

    Have you ever cleaned carbs before, or just not on the 1100? If you rear carbs 101 and 102, there aren't a ton of differences, the general process is still the same. Biggest difference I found was removing the floats - the pin holding them in is an interference fit. Get an automatic center punch, whack it a few times (carefully!!), and out comes the pin.
    Last edited by shpielers; 12-17-2014, 07:33 PM.
    1998 Katana 750
    1992 Katana 1100
    2006 Ninja 250

    2006 Katana 600 RIP - 130k miles

    Comment


    • #3
      No, I've never rebuilt carbs at all. Looking over a few threads it doesn't seem too hard though. I'm just not sure what all I need to buy. Do all the gaskets and stuff come in a kit ? Also, is this the automatic punch you speak of ?


      As for my issue, I'm on the fence about this engine until I get to the source of the smoke. I just don't want to take it down the road and have a melt down or some thing. The warmer the motor gets and the harder I rev it the more it smokes. I'm so scared I may have a cracked block or busted gasket.
      My Katana-1100 17" wheel swap
      http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=136894

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by katanarider View Post
        No, I've never rebuilt carbs at all. Looking over a few threads it doesn't seem too hard though. I'm just not sure what all I need to buy. Do all the gaskets and stuff come in a kit ? Also, is this the automatic punch you speak of ?


        As for my issue, I'm on the fence about this engine until I get to the source of the smoke. I just don't want to take it down the road and have a melt down or some thing. The warmer the motor gets and the harder I rev it the more it smokes. I'm so scared I may have a cracked block or busted gasket.

        As far as the punch, yep! That's what you're looking for. You can also use a standard punch. The pins are in there pretty good.

        As far as carb rebuild kits, they have pretty much everything you'll need except 1 oring - the one that goes with the A/F adjustment screw. I bought a few from Arsenic. Kits will come with a bowl gasket, and an oring for the float assembly. You'll need to pull the screen off the original float assembly and transfer it to the new one if your rebuild kit comes with new float needles.
        Here's the kit I used:
        Be sure to add me to your !4 BRAND NEW CARB kit for:1988-93 GSX1100F KATANAYou are bidding on a set of 4 kits.THESE KITS COME WITH BOWL GASKET, O-RING AND FLOAT NEEDLE AND SEAT ASSEMBLY. ThanksOn Oct-22-03 at 00:23:53 PDT, seller added the following infor

        There are many other places to get kits from as well.

        For the smoke - have you cleaned the motor off yet and looked for oil leaks? Use some engine degreaser and a scrub brush, go to town, rinse everything off, and sprinkle some baby powder onto the engine. You'll be able to find an oil leak very easily then.
        I doubt it would be a head gasket - that would have showed up on your compression test. Unless you've crashed pretty hard, I doubt it would be a cracked block either, but it very well might be a cracked cover. The oil cooler lines are also supposed to be a somewhat common culprit.
        If you haven't already, pull the fairings - it'll make finding the source much easier. Also, you dont want to run the engine with the bike idling for more than 10 minutes. It's oil cooled, so without air moving over it, it'll toast itself pretty quickly.

        For the smoke you noticed from your left pipe:
        white = water
        blue = oil
        black = gas
        If you're not entirely sure what color it is, hold up a white sheet of paper or a white towel etc behind it.
        Last edited by shpielers; 12-18-2014, 05:17 AM.
        1998 Katana 750
        1992 Katana 1100
        2006 Ninja 250

        2006 Katana 600 RIP - 130k miles

        Comment


        • #5
          I've never rode the bike at all or seen it run for that matter. I bought it for $400 off Craigslist. Its only got 14,*** miles and last inspection was 1999.

          I think I've got a good idea of the problem. Its got to be the head or a valve stem. That would explain good compression and decent looking plugs. A leak down tester would be ideal but I just don't have the cash at the moment. If you look at Locomotions another rebuild from blighty thread you'll notice the oil drain is pretty close to the exhaust ports. It may have cracked or a rusty valve could have pulled the valve stem seal loose or even dry rotted. I'm gonna remove the valve cover this weekend. I'm not sure what kind of valve spring compressor I'll need. Any advice on that would be cool.

          Thanks for the replies !
          My Katana-1100 17" wheel swap
          http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=136894

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by katanarider View Post
            I've never rode the bike at all or seen it run for that matter. I bought it for $400 off Craigslist. Its only got 14,*** miles and last inspection was 1999.
            Ha, sounds like mine! I was able to ride it up and down the street at least though. Literally have .5 miles on it since picking it up last January. The chain and sprockets were all sorts of dead, so never got it above 3k rpm.

            You might be able to rent a leak down tester, I know there's a place local to me that will do that. As far as a valve spring compressor...no idea. Only engine I've done head work on was my ninja 250, and I managed without one. (Major major major pain in the €¥¥!!! Had access to one for a car sized engine, wouldn't fit the teeny 250...) PM Locomotion, he's fairly active and super helpful, I'm sure he'd be able to point you in the right direction. Or probably anyone with an engine rebuild thread, even if it's not an 1100, shouldn't matter.
            1998 Katana 750
            1992 Katana 1100
            2006 Ninja 250

            2006 Katana 600 RIP - 130k miles

            Comment


            • #7
              You'll need a specific spring compressor to get all of them off without throwing things. NAPA has a few choices. You will need a direct down press compressor, a footed one works but, can be a total pain on some springs. This worked perfectly for me, http://m.napaonline.com/parts/PartsD...842_0199239212
              "I'm sorry, I didn't mean to upset you when I called you stupid. I thought you already knew..."
              spammer police
              USAF veteran
              If your a veteran, join the KR veterans group

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by 92xjunker View Post
                You'll need a specific spring compressor to get all of them off without throwing things. NAPA has a few choices. You will need a direct down press compressor, a footed one works but, can be a total pain on some springs. This worked perfectly for me, http://m.napaonline.com/parts/PartsD...842_0199239212
                I want a spring compressor that does not require me to remove the head.
                I've looked around on the web but most of them seem too big for motorcycle springs.
                My Katana-1100 17" wheel swap
                http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=136894

                Comment


                • #9
                  UPDATE: After chatting with my man loneraider I took the bike for a cruise. Wow, what a difference in the smoke issue. Its not completely healed but for now, its 85-90% better than it was. Gosh, its got so much more power than the kat 600

                  For you guys trying to bleed your clutch, it pays to have a sucktion pump (did I spell that right ?) Anyway, the thing that sucks the fluid to the nipple. I put my finger at the outlet of the clutch lever with the line disconnected while pumping, there has to be vacume on the line first for the lever to pump.
                  Peace on earth and goodwill to men, Merry Christmas everyone !
                  My Katana-1100 17" wheel swap
                  http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=136894

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by katanarider View Post
                    UPDATE: After chatting with my man loneraider I took the bike for a cruise. Wow, what a difference in the smoke issue. Its not completely healed but for now, its 85-90% better than it was. Gosh, its got so much more power than the kat 600
                    What did Loneraider recommend that ended up making the difference in the amount of smoke you were seeing?

                    For the suction thing - you mean like a mityvac? They're supposed to be awesome. So far I've rebuilt the MC and slave cylinder, new SS lines, and good synthetic fluid, and the clutch still seems to drag despite much bleeding by hand. So I'm picking one of these up for myself after the holidays. Or before if I see one on sale...
                    1998 Katana 750
                    1992 Katana 1100
                    2006 Ninja 250

                    2006 Katana 600 RIP - 130k miles

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      My advice was that if the kats have been sitting for awhile ,well they need a good run. Maybe the owner before threw some extra oil down the cyl's or the bike was flooded due to a weak battery, who knows?? but at least now its a lot better than it was! He is still in need of a proper carb clean or rebuild,sync, ect..ect...ect.. but at least he can ride it to a friends place or a shop if he needs to.... Here's a great running 1100

                      Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.
                      Last edited by loneraider; 12-21-2014, 01:37 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by shpielers View Post
                        What did Loneraider recommend that ended up making the difference in the amount of smoke you were seeing?

                        For the suction thing - you mean like a mityvac? They're supposed to be awesome. So far I've rebuilt the MC and slave cylinder, new SS lines, and good synthetic fluid, and the clutch still seems to drag despite much bleeding by hand. So I'm picking one of these up for myself after the holidays. Or before if I see one on sale...
                        Yes, a Mityvac I guess. I never knew thats what they were called. My neighbor let me use his.
                        Happy St. Patrick's Day, Ireland! #GoogleDoodle

                        The one I used didn't work too well with the inline catch can that is part of the device so I just hooked the pump straight to the nipple. It sucked the fluid out the rear of the pump on to the ground, messy but it worked great. I remember reading guys having trouble with bleeding so I disconnect my line and sprayed brake cleaner down the tube. A whole bunch of chocolate syrup looking $#!T came out, yuck ! I pumped it a million times and it just doesn't work. If you put your finger over the hole at the clutch lever and pump it, you'll get a idea of how the system works. It requires suction and you'll see just what I mean when you slightly pull your finger off the hole because it will squirt out. I hate to say this but I bet you could have made your stock parts work. Plus, you CAN, %100 bleed it with the master cylinder cap OFF ! As you vacume on the hose keep suction when you close off the nipple, then attempt to build pressure at the lever...Even as you begin bleeding, don't let all of the fluid pump out because you want to keep good vacume in the hose. I closed off the nipple at about 3/4 of the bleed as to not loose negative pressure in the line. Now I build such great pressure I can't pump the lever more than 3 times before its too stiff. Oh yeah, I primed the line first before all of that which I just explained. I did this by pouring fluid in a small cup and sticking the other side of the hose in the cup and useing the pump to suck fluid to the nipple. Good luck !

                        As for my smoke issue, yeah I just drove it about a mile or two and the smoke has cleared greatly. Its still leaking oil into the exhaust because the mid pipe clamp is a little wet. None, the less its a hell of a lot better. Hopefully its just a valve stem seal.
                        Last edited by katanarider; 12-21-2014, 08:55 AM.
                        My Katana-1100 17" wheel swap
                        http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=136894

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Sounds like it is coming along nicely. Lone rider is a helpful guy good to hear he is spreading Christmas cheer or advice lol

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