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project almost done and im bored...

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  • #76
    trial and error, don't you wish you had a dyno.....
    "I'm sorry, I didn't mean to upset you when I called you stupid. I thought you already knew..."
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    • #77
      Yes, I wish I had my own dyno. I'm all for trial and error as it is part of learning, and given things that have been done so far to the bike I think that is all there really is to do at this point.

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      • #78
        What are odds that the loss or low Power is switching From simi to full synthetic oil? Because i notice a difference in the way the power kicks in after the oil change. Maybe?

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        • #79
          As 92 was saying, the CV carbs are very dependent upon the air pressures and flow. Pods do not provide enough restriction to give the proper pressures and flow for CV carbs.
          No blocking/regulation of variable pressures and air flow when in real world enviroments
          You may be able to make changes to the motor to account for more air flow but as long as you are using CV carbs, these issues are going to be a challenge. The issue is not with the motor, but more so how the Carbs are designed to feed the engine.

          Hiflo systems do not allow the carbs to function correctly. Tuning the motor to run well off carbs that are not functioning properly is not solving the problem.

          That's just my .02 A

          s for the oil change (im no professional) but oil is oil when it comes to the average rider. If there is oil in the bike, and it is flowing correctly through the cooling system, then it's all doing the same thing. I dont personally think using 1 kind of oil over another is going to increase/decrease physical performance. It may make the bike run cooler, or better lubricated but imo that is not going to calculate into a performance increase the rider is going to notice/feel. Good oil doesnt make you go faster, it makes your bike last longer.
          Last edited by maniac1886; 01-27-2015, 11:04 AM.
          My build thread (Black Betty) '97 600 (Dearly Departed)
          http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=133286
          2007 GSXR 750

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          • #80
            Originally posted by i3notsr View Post
            So even with extra flow and pods working well enough for me not to even notice a flat spot the K&N still will be bad with the stock airbox? I thought that the reason to stay away from the K&N filters and stick to the OEM paper was because it acted like pods. I might try both the paper and the K&N when I throw the stock airbox back in just to see what's what. I'm all for trying different setups with this.

            Lots of people like to say "pods work fine" and then give a lot of "seat of the pants dyno" evidence. When asked/questioned about actually showing a dyno results, they dismiss or ignore it (or at least, it never gets posted!).


            The flat spot your seeing isn't going to hurt the bike per say. It's not going to cause a major hitch in riding it, or make it un ride able. Those concerns have been tuned out. What it will generally do is create vibration at that rpm range. Since that range is 5-7k rpms, that puts the vibration right in the middle of your "cruise" range. Going down the highway for example in 6th gear... your stuck right in the vibration prone point. Also, long term riding in that range will increase the heat generation because it's from running lean. Lean will give you more "snap" response but higher heat generation.


            Aggressive riding... keeping the rpms over 8k, your definitely not going to feel a response problem as the dyno clearly shows for your setup, those rpm ranges are smoother and progressive as would be expected.


            Over all though, I do believe you are loosing power by having the bike tuned for pods. If the carb was instead tuned with the OEM airbox and paper filter... I personally believe you could see not only elimination of the flat spot, but also an over all improvement in performance.


            With a stock exhaust, you are no where near needing a high flow air filter.


            IF.... you do get a full on custom exhaust, you MIGHT could then see about using a single higher flow air filter in the stock air box. Even then, proper tuning of the intake port would be nessasary. The "default" of having 2 size donuts to use what works best is just a simplified version of putting all your $ and time right back in the crap hole. Pods... never with CV carbs. Just no. No amount of "tuning" is going to counter the many other issues that pods cause with the stock CV carbs simply due to their shape and mounting. It's not only about how much air they let through the filtation... they just don't mount right.


            Pods with mechanical carbs like flatsides, much less of an issue for the pods. It's just the tuning you have to do for the carbs themselves that sucks in that setup.



            Originally posted by i3notsr View Post
            What are odds that the loss or low Power is switching From simi to full synthetic oil? Because i notice a difference in the way the power kicks in after the oil change. Maybe?


            I would expect that there would be no difference in power/performance with the oil options you mentioned of any noticeable or measurable difference as it would apply to a dyno. Differences in how shifting feels, how it responds to heat varainces, and cooling sure...


            Krey
            93 750 Kat



            Modified Swingarm, 5.5 GSXR Rear with 180/55 and 520 Chain, 750 to 600 Tail conversion, more to come. Long Term Project build thread http://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=96736

            "I've done this a thousand times before. What could possibly go wron.... Ooops!"

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            • #81
              i think im going to get the stock box put back on the bike just to see what happens. I need to open up the bike a little more to gauge how the bike reacts now compared to before the oil change, the cam manufacturer specified to use conventional oil we just put synthetic in for heat managment. Changing back to the blend that was in the bike originally is justbme messing.with stuff really. Because when i picked the bike up origianlly they said it was putting down about 105 to the wheel. So i just want to run it back how it was and see what i get it all.

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              • #82
                I like the Kreylyn long posts, makes for some knowledgable reading.
                "I'm sorry, I didn't mean to upset you when I called you stupid. I thought you already knew..."
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                • #83
                  Well I found a guy that should be able to do up the exhaust system for me, I just need to get ahold of him (friend from schools boss). First things first though I ordered a cheap delkevic slip on just so I can stop running the straight pipe and to see how or if it scrapes being mounted low by the footpeg or just above it, then on the the full system. I have an idea but I don't want to spill the beans yet lol. I ordered a replacement OEM air filter and i'm going to trash the bike some with the pods then re-install the airbox and see how that goes. I have nothing better to do so why not. Thank for the explanations on how the carbs work and the difference between the two main types. I also picked up a gallon of the oil that was originally in the bike just for shits and giggles, 30 bucks isn't going to kill me. I will keep this updated and if I feel any decent differences i'll get the bike on the dyno again. Now i'm wondering...are headers for a bike like a car? As in will different lengths before the collector change things up drastically, or is it not worth it?

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                  • #84
                    The stock duals are equal length. 4 to 1, the outer two are slightly longer only because of the way they have to run and meet, varying the length is not going to yield anything, pipe diameter will effect things much more.
                    "I'm sorry, I didn't mean to upset you when I called you stupid. I thought you already knew..."
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                    If your a veteran, join the KR veterans group

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                    • #85
                      Ok, i had a feeling thats how it would work. Thank you.

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