[Heeltoeclutch]

Yep, looks like an OEM that needs replaced to me. Lol.

Other rubber... No, if you have them split... choke rails, slide guides, main and pilot jets, float rails, diaphrams, Air / Fuel screws all out of the bodies... that should cover all rubber.

I normally take the orings off things like the float rails, seperate them... and soak the rails/floats too in the carb dip. The rails have jets in them for the choke.

After the soak, use carb aerosol spray through all of the ports. Make sure every one has spray come out the same way. What I mean by that is pay attention to the flow. Does it dribble out on one, but come out a fine stream on another? That's a clear sign of something still being blocked. (There shouldn't be any that dribble fyi... all of them should have large enough clear ports that the flow isn't interrupted, it's the jets that "restrict" the flow.)

Other things I do...

Use compressed air 120psi to blow out the carbs after the spray rinse. Remove all liquids, helps to further blow anything lurking inside out, and helps to remove any dip from the felt gaskets on the linkage.

As you assemble, machine oil is a good option for the linkages. It helps keep the butterflies from sticking.

Once fully assembled make sure you bench sync the carbs.

Krey

Thanks a lot!!!

Here are some terms I am a little confused about:

- Choke rails, different from choke slide?
- Float rails, are these the plastic hinged bit with the very snug O-rings?
- Linkage, I am guessing this is the coiled spring/butterfly?

I must say it makes me quite nervous to soak the float components in the dip, as I've read that carb cleaner can eat plastic.... and I don't want to kill 4 expensive float assemblies. Also as previously mentioned I am concerned about taking them apart without breaking them. Plastic and I don't always get along...

Good tip about sanding the caps, I haven't seen that anywhere else. I will check them for flatness. I also ordered some silicone spray lubricant, as I read that is the best lube for o-rings and will not cause swelling unlike petroleum-based things.

[Kreylyn]

Thanks a lot!!!

Here are some terms I am a little confused about:

- Choke rails, different from choke slide?
- Float rails, are these the plastic hinged bit with the very snug O-rings?
- Linkage, I am guessing this is the coiled spring/butterfly?

Yes, choke rails / choke slides would refer to the same thing.
Yes, float rails would be the part the floats attach too, has the orings on them, and sticks into the carbs.
Yes, linkage would be the metal brackets that hold the butterflies and use the coiled springs to put tension on them. They link all 4 bodies together, and hold the sync screws.

I must say it makes me quite nervous to soak the float components in the dip, as I've read that carb cleaner can eat plastic.... and I don't want to kill 4 expensive float assemblies. Also as previously mentioned I am concerned about taking them apart without breaking them. Plastic and I don't always get along...

I have spares, so let me say this... If I'm wrong... replacements will be in the mail. already cleaned.

Good tip about sanding the caps, I haven't seen that anywhere else. I will check them for flatness. I also ordered some silicone spray lubricant, as I read that is the best lube for o-rings and will not cause swelling unlike petroleum-based things.

Krey

[Heeltoeclutch]

Yes, choke rails / choke slides would refer to the same thing.
Yes, float rails would be the part the floats attach too, has the orings on them, and sticks into the carbs.
Yes, linkage would be the metal brackets that hold the butterflies and use the coiled springs to put tension on them. They link all 4 bodies together, and hold the sync screws.

I have spares, so let me say this... If I'm wrong... replacements will be in the mail. already cleaned.



Krey

Thank you thank you. Sorry, one last question I should've asked earlier -


You mentioned during reassembly to use machine oil on the linkages. Is it necessary to disassemble the linkages+butterfly valves before dipping? The service manual says the screws are peened in place, and you mentioned needing new screws to replace them. The butterflies/linkages all seem to operate fine; I wouldn't think it necessary to rip them apart?


I will try to gingerly disassemble the floats - in the service manual it simply says to "Unhook the needle valve from the floats". Well, I hope it's that easy.

[Kreylyn]

Thank you thank you. Sorry, one last question I should've asked earlier -


You mentioned during reassembly to use machine oil on the linkages. Is it necessary to disassemble the linkages+butterfly valves before dipping? The service manual says the screws are peened in place, and you mentioned needing new screws to replace them. The butterflies/linkages all seem to operate fine; I wouldn't think it necessary to rip them apart?


I will try to gingerly disassemble the floats - in the service manual it simply says to "Unhook the needle valve from the floats". Well, I hope it's that easy.

Not necessary to remove the butterflies and linkage from the bodies. If you wanted too, you would want to replace the screws, they are peened and in most cases could result in needing the heads to be drilled out. Some of them will not come out otherwise.

Krey

[Heeltoeclutch]

Not necessary to remove the butterflies and linkage from the bodies. If you wanted too, you would want to replace the screws, they are peened and in most cases could result in needing the heads to be drilled out. Some of them will not come out otherwise.

Krey

Excellent! Thanks.

Tomorrow I am off to the store to pick up the dip. Will try to get the rest of the rail screws out, choke plungers out, and floats apart, then the dipping will commence. Will update tomorrow!

[Heeltoeclutch]

Not necessary to remove the butterflies and linkage from the bodies. If you wanted too, you would want to replace the screws, they are peened and in most cases could result in needing the heads to be drilled out. Some of them will not come out otherwise.

Krey

Well I can hardly believe it, but the carbs and floats are apart, and #1 is in the dip!



I have to say Krey, you gave me the confidence and guidance needed to do this - it probably sounds silly to the veteran mechanics on here, but that's a big deal to me! Thank you!

If anyone reads this in the future, a few things of note:

A couple of the rail screws were being very difficult; no luck with my best philips, and I could not track down affordable JIS bits or drivers in time. As such, I dremeled slots into the offenders and broke them free with a slot bit.



Additionally, I noticed that on some of the floats, the little metal clip that fastens the needle to the... rail (?) was fastened from the back, and some were fastened from the front. Does this matter? Seemed to work either way.



Now it's a waiting game, while they soak for the next 4 days. I could only fit one in at a time. As such, I did an oil change..... and the oil smelled like gas. However only 4 qts total came out. I suspected the carbs of leaking fuel into the oil before, but thought that problem was alleviated. I only ever rode it from purchasing to inlaws house, then inlaws to home. As I mentioned the tank was rusty (gruesome pic below), and im guessing it messed with the needles sealing.



However, the needles look to be in great shape, and my hope is once the float rails are clean also they will seat well. The final leak check you suggested will be the indicator.



While they are soaking I will start looking at the other areas of the bike that need to be addressed - front brake pads and fork seals. Before I order and pay $10 shipping for the carb fuel and air tees, want to make sure I don't need anything else! (If you know of any common wear parts on these areas, I'm all ears! Measured the rotor thickness and they are good.)

Thanks!!!

[shpielers]

Brake fluid (and SS brake lines)
Extra fairing bolts
Turn signal bulb
Probably have to come from a different source, but spare key

[92xjunker]

POR-15 will fix that tank.

[Heeltoeclutch]

Brake fluid (and SS brake lines)
Extra fairing bolts
Turn signal bulb
Probably have to come from a different source, but spare key

POR-15 will fix that tank.

Thanks shpielers and junker - i have electrolysysed the tank and I have DOT4 brake fluid, however I saw in a thread a recommendation for G&J aircraft as a source for SS brake lines. Do they make custom lengths, do you have to specify fittings, etc? Or a ready-made kit? Didn't gather too much from their site.

[shpielers]

Used them 2x so far, about to use them again as I just picked up another Kat.
Call em up, specify which bike you have, and if you want extra length. They've got a template for the angles/fittings already. If you want custom length, they just cut longer sections of hose before putting on the fittings.

[Heeltoeclutch]

Thanks shpielers, I'll call them.

Ok, so carb #1 is finished soaking. impressions - a lot of loosened gunk on the outside; not totally removed, but comes off with a paper towel. I tried to rinse it with carb cleaner on the parts that matter (choke circuit, A/F screw hole, etc)

A question/concern - on the can it says to not soak "coated aluminum parts" for more than 4 hours. After I soaked carb #1 for 24 hours, it is now a different color than the rest:

*

*


Looking into this, there is an explanation on Berryman's website:

What you're seeing is aluminum hydroxide slowly desorb from the surface of the carburetors. This occurs in some aluminum and aluminum alloys that are especially susceptible to chemical attack as a result of extended exposure to Chem-Dip

(thread here)

Krey, I'm guessing you've never had a problem with the darker, longtime-soaked carbs?

Thanks!

[Kreylyn]

Thanks shpielers, I'll call them.

Ok, so carb #1 is finished soaking. impressions - a lot of loosened gunk on the outside; not totally removed, but comes off with a paper towel. I tried to rinse it with carb cleaner on the parts that matter (choke circuit, A/F screw hole, etc)

A question/concern - on the can it says to not soak "coated aluminum parts" for more than 4 hours. After I soaked carb #1 for 24 hours, it is now a different color than the rest:

*

*


Looking into this, there is an explanation on Berryman's website:

What you're seeing is aluminum hydroxide slowly desorb from the surface of the carburetors. This occurs in some aluminum and aluminum alloys that are especially susceptible to chemical attack as a result of extended exposure to Chem-Dip

(thread here)

Krey, I'm guessing you've never had a problem with the darker, longtime-soaked carbs?

Thanks!

Never an issue.

I always end up following up with a round in the blast cabinet too thought to make em extra purty...

Krey

[Heeltoeclutch]

Thanks Krey,

Finished soaking all the carbs - I soaked #3 and #4 for 12 hours each to be on the safer side pre-your-reply. Everything seems to be clean, and the passages all seem to be flowing and spraying equally. The silicone spray lubricant I ordered is my new favorite tool - it's safe on rubber, made installing the O-rings easy and it really helped get the floats in with the snug O-rings.

One thing I noticed while I was putting the carbs back together is the choke plungers felt a little sticky where the brass plunger rubs against the aluminum carb body, after thoroughly cleaning both parts. I tried the silicone spray lube, which mildly helped, and 3-in-1 oil, which helped more - but still a liiiiittle bit sticky. I think they should function fine, but we'll see.

Got the carbs mostly back together yesterday, but waiting on the fuel and air tees to arrive at the dealer sometime in the next couple of days. Ended up being cheaper than online with shipping. C&D Cycle, if anyone is in San Diego. Also started pulling plugs last night, and realized I didn't have an 18mm plug socket.

Tonight I am picking up the plug socket, replacing the (current, mystery) spark plugs with the standard DR8ES, and doing your carb cap flatness check, Krey. One of the carb caps has a tiny chunk taken out of an edge of the flat part, but it's so small I don't think that alone should mess with sealing of the carbs. Here's to hoping once they're back together, no more leaks...!

[Heeltoeclutch]

Never an issue.

I always end up following up with a round in the blast cabinet too thought to make em extra purty...

Krey

UPDATE - didn't have time to get to the plugs tonight, but my fuel and air tees came in. I sanded the caps flat and fully reassembled the carbs with the new tees - immediately the fit was different. The old fuel tees swiveled freely; the new ones are snug.

After they were back together, I fed them some gas through some Raider 5/16" clear blue fuel line. (encountered issues with my temp gas bottle, so just fed a column of fuel through the lines)


Here are things I noticed after feeding the newly assembled carbs gas, and closely observing for 20 minutes:

- The major leak has stopped at the fuel tees. That was gushing before, now gone. However, I suspect there may be an issue with fuel line fit and the fuel tees - perhaps I need some spring clamps, as there might be a little fuel escaping there if the lines aren't FULLY squished onto the tee fittings.

- The needle valves seem to be seating. The carbs would drink in gas, and then stop. No overflowing through the mouth or engine-side area, which is where I imagine it would escape, or perhaps the pilot jets. Nothing there.

- There looks to be a SLIGHT LEAK at the bowl gasket area of carbs #1 and #2. After wiping dry, tiny amounts of gas would appear in the area near the mating surfaces. On carbs #3 & #4, no such fuel appearing. Seems perfectly sealed. So, my supposition is I need to order two new bowl gaskets for #1 and 2.

For some reason this photo of carb 1's wet mating surface is showing upside-down:


I am letting it sit overnight, with several inches of fuel in the lines, as suggested and we will see what it looks like in the morning. I really hope the gaskets fix carbs #1 and #2.... if that doesn't do it, I don't really know where to go from there.

[shpielers]

maybe cover the end of the fuel line so it can't evaporate out? Don't think enough would evaporate to create a vacuum...